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Thread: Rumsfeld OK'd sexual humiliation of Iraqi prisoners

  1. #1
    PeedeeShaolin
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    Default Rumsfeld OK'd sexual humiliation of Iraqi prisoners

    The associated press said today:
    Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld authorized the expansion of a secret program that encouraged physical coercion and sexual humiliation of Iraqi prisoners to obtain intelligence about the growing insurgency in Iraq, The New Yorker reported Saturday.
    Just like a rich-boy chicken hawk to order rough treatment and then "come down hard" on the soldiers who followed orders. Alot of the soldiers are talking about how intelligence officials told the MPs the abuse the prisoners so they would be more cooperative during interrogations.

    The intelligence sources told the magazine photos of the sexual abuse were used to intimidate prisoners and detainees into providing information on the insurgency. It was thought that some prisoners would do anything including spying on their associates to avoid dissemination of the shameful photos to family and friends.
    And you know the soldiers will get hung out to dry and nobody is going to say a word.

    Why do you think someone would intentionally violate the Geneva Convention and then take PICTURES of it? Are our soldiers the DUMBEST people on the planet? I doubt it. I think they weren't afraid to get caught because they were following orders. They obviously had no fear of their actions. Why the fukk else would you tape sexual abuse and shiit like that? Just the fact that its our soldiers who DID it! Supposedly the CIA got sick of the whole thing and left:
    One intelligence official said the CIA ended its involvement with the program at Abu Ghraib prison by last fall.


    "They said, 'No way. We signed up for the core program in Afghanistan pre-approved for operations against the high-value terrorist targets and now you want to use it for cabdrivers, brothers-in-law, and people pulled off the streets,'" the source said.
    I personally think the CIA is fed up with this whole shitstorm and is blowing some whistles. Many whistles have been blown as of late.

    I wonder if the bought and paid for press will talk about this or just find another Lacy Petersen to cry over.

    You can read the story from the associated press here:

    http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=stor...se_rumsfeld_17

    And you can read the story in The New Yorker orticle here:

    http://www.newyorker.com/fact/content/?040524fa_fact

    And the head of the Washington office of the International Committee of the Red Cross has resigned for "personal reasons," amid turmoil created by a secret ICRC report on Iraqi prisoner abuse by U.S. forces.

    LIBERATE IRAQ!! YAY FREEDOM!!

  2. #2
    Merry Christmas Bitch Ronin's Avatar
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    Interesting....

  3. #3
    Dochter
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    Much of the chain of command obviously has responsibility. The people doing the deeds are not removed from reponsibility just because of orders.

    I seem to recall a big trial involving that argument. I think it started with an "N" and had something to do with illegal orders.

  4. #4
    Merry Christmas Bitch Ronin's Avatar
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    The excuse of "following orders" does not hold up here, I assume its the same in the States?

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    CaptShady's Avatar
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    Originally posted by ronin69
    The excuse of "following orders" does not hold up here, I assume its the same in the States?
    Yep!

  6. #6
    Decafinated white belt. Nihilanthic's Avatar
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    <soapbox>
    Hey Peedee!!! Did you totally miss my thread? We're doing it to our own fucking children. Do you not care or are you just unaware?
    http://www.askquestions.org/details.php?id=209 <- check out my little attempt at getting media attention. Check my "sick and fucking disgusting" thread in OT.
    </soapbox>

    I'm just *slightly* PO'd our own kids get less consideration when they're abused just as bad on a larger scale for the past 20 years, than some grown men in Iraq. Sorry, but our kids > other adults. Call me Jingoistic or selfish or whatever. I don't care. I'm just sick and tired of people getting up in arms about things a world away and turning a blind eye to domestic issues.

    I half expect to be told "bla bla that doesn't matter BUSH SUCKS!!!1 IRAQ UNJUST WAR!!1one" Guess what, Bush is supportive of the treatment institutions. PM for info if you read this, PeeDee.
    Katana, on 540 kicks: "Hang from a ceiling fan with both hands. Flail your feet out and ask people to walk into you as you hit their face."

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    PeedeeShaolin
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    I think you totally miss the point Nil. The SOLDIERS are going to be the ones that get fukked for this, even though they were following orders. Those are the people, unlike Donald "rummy" Rumsfeld, that actually have the balls to go fight for a country they were bullshitted into believing was in danger. To see them take the fall because of the policies of an inept and criminal administration means you think a chicken hawk like Rumsfeld should get to sit in his easy chair and dictate even MORE nonsense while young soldiers are used as scapegoats to take the blame. This has happened more than once during this administrations short reign of conquest.

    Those teen camps in the U.S. are a symptom of a much larger problem within our sysytem and much of the western world. They symbolize the idea that humiliation and force are the best ways to handle a situation and it stems from a gross, one-sided power trip. It starts with institutuons like military school and finishes with violations of the Geneva convention and American forces forcing foreign soldiers to suck each others diicks for intimidation purposes.

    Any military(ex) here want to comment? Do you think these soldiers should be court martialsed and dragged over the coals by themselves for this?

    The U.S. is in a time of war. Every citizen should be concerned about whats going on and be as up to date as possible. Instead you have people that could care less. Its like a TV show to them. War time is the time when the power of our government is at its peak over the common citizen. Our lack of concern and ignorance has reached the point that even when our soldiers are instructed to do things that the U.S. government will not even allow the public to SEE we STILL dont care. You have people going back and forth and "supporting our troops" but then letting them get screwed by the rich boy chicken hawk brass who tells them to voilate human rights and then hides and places the blame on them. NOW the armchair soldiers could care less about what happens to the troops who were doing what they were told.

    Take a look back at Vietnam! WOW that war was worth it huh? 50,000 dead Americans and over a million Vietnamese, all to stop communism(which translates to a bunch of yellow people wanting to share rice).

    The excuse of "following orders" does not hold up here, I assume its the same in the States?
    Isn't it common sense that the person who ordered this and the people responsible for the policies created should at LEAST be punished right along side the people following those orders? If your answer is "no" then Hitler would have waled free because he didnt commit any of the atrocities during WWII, he only ok'd the actions.

  8. #8
    Merry Christmas Bitch Ronin's Avatar
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    I think there is enough blame to go around.
    The buck MUST stop somewhere.
    But, lets not forget that, no one is FORCED or OBLIGED to follow an order that violates international law.
    That being said, IF they were ordered then ALL that are involved should be exposed.
    But, even if they were not and just decide to be jerk-offs, the chain of command was NOT obeyed and somewhere along the line, it has to be asked: "Where does the buck stop?"

  9. #9
    WingChun Lawyer
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    Originally posted by ronin69

    But, even if they were not and just decide to be jerk-offs, the chain of command was NOT obeyed and somewhere along the line, it has to be asked: "Where does the buck stop?"
    Man, as Dochter said...remember Nuremberg. All those who issued the orders should be prosecuted, same as those who obeyed them. IMHO, the only questionable responsibility is that of the officers who were vague about how their orders should be executed, but even them should be prosecuted if they knew what was going on.

  10. #10
    patfromlogan's Avatar
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    http://www.toledoblade.com/apps/pbcs...y=SRTIGERFORCE

    Three Blade (Toledo Ohio) reporters won the Pulitzer Prize - journalism's highest honor - for uncovering the atrocities of an elite U.S. Army fighting unit in the Vietnam War that killed unarmed civilians and children during a seven-month rampage. Rumsfeld, whose office declined to comment on the series, served his first stint as secretary of defense under President Gerald Ford beginning in November, 1975 - the same month the Tiger Force investigation was closed.

    Hmmmmmmmm...

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