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RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 11:05 AM
I have skated by as a Negative Atheist, passing the burden of proof on Theists, for about a few years. I wanted to try my hand at Positive Atheist arguments. I hope to provide evidence that the traditional view of the Christian God (the religion I am most versed in) is wrong.

My evidence will be based on the assumption that the Bible is the accurate word of God and that God is all powerful, all knowing and benevolent.

I am looking for critical feedback.

Here I go:

1) If God is all powerful and all knowing, why would it use people as a primary method of transmitting it's message.

The obvious error is that humans are fallible and could easily interpret the message incorrectly. Thinking deeper you realize how flawed this method is. Go back to the origin of the Church. This all powerful, all knowing God depended on humans with very limited forms of transportation to spread it's message. While Christianity eventually spread all over the world, generations lived and died without even knowing Christianity existed. According to the bible, by not believing in the Christian God, these people committed the sin of Apostasy and would be sent to Hell for eternal torture. These people would suffer because of God's decision to use humans as the primary means to transmit It's message.

2) The story of Noah's Ark.

In the time this story is set, there is one good man on the Earth surrounded by evil people. God wants to remove these evil people by creating a planet wide flood. Wait, what?! This is one the greatest examples of God not being all powerful, all knowing and benevolent. If God is all powerful, why didn't he just smite all the evil people or will them not to exist? On top of that, these evil people supposedly have young children among them. Are they evil too? Let me ignore this for a second and return to the story. God tasks the only Good man in the world to spend half of his life in hard labor to create the ark (very rewarding). God then commands animals to march two by two into the ark, there is a flood, etc. By using this flood, God kills all the evil people, all their innocent children and every land animal that wasn't in the ark. Were the animals evil too? The most important implication of this story is that despite God's flood evil people continue to inhabit the Earth. You may argue that God only wanted to balance the overpowering amount of evil on the earth. But if God is all powerful, why use a sloppy approach that kills innocent children and the majority of Earth's animals?

3) It is impossible to be merciful and just.

God is portrayed to be merciful and just but those two concepts can not coexist. For example, let's say I am the most selfless and kind Atheist in the world. Compare this to Joe, who consistently commits various acts of murder, rape and torture. If Joe becomes a Christian in the last year of his life, all is forgiven and he gets to go to heaven. I, on the other hand, commit Apostasy and is sentenced to hell. This judgement grants mercy to Joe but is unmerciful to me and unjust to all parties.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
29th May 12, 11:13 AM
Any attempt to reconcile the Abrahamic God with logic is fallacious, whether you're trying to prove or disprove his existence, because he is a supralogical being.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
29th May 12, 11:15 AM
plus your arguments suck balls tbh

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
29th May 12, 11:25 AM
My evidence will be based on the assumption that the Bible is the accurate word of God and that God is all powerful, all knowing and benevolent.

Your premise is assuming a conclusion. If we define our starting points then it is easy to prove our end results.

1) GOD (TM primitive geometry) is a triangle

2) Triangles are everywhere

3) Therefore GOD (TM primitive geometry) exists

See that?

Fucking pointless!

RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 11:35 AM
Thank you for your input. Can someone provide a proper argument for Positive Atheism?

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
29th May 12, 11:52 AM
Just accept it Jesus loves you!!!

Lebell
29th May 12, 12:00 PM
this has the reasoning and logic skills of a child.
you fail as an atheist, and as a human being.
go suck your richard dawkins' cock and die.

Lebell
29th May 12, 12:00 PM
oh, but Jesus loves you nonetheless.
maybe even more so.

Lebell
29th May 12, 12:05 PM
I'll give a quick explanation for retards, its really speeded up cos im cooking food and i gotta go drinking in a bit.

-let's say I claim there's a blue rabbit on the dark side of the moon.

you can not claim it is factual untrue as nobody's ever been to the dark side of the moon.
Neither can I prove there is one.

You can follow logic and then it's a reasonable, even highly likely assertion that rabbits, let alone blue ones can NOT live on the dark side of the moon.

Assertion, still inconclusive.

Now God.
Over centuries same sorta claim: you cant disprove, you cant prove this.

Here the assertion is harder:it isnt sucha clear cut deal like with the blue rabbit on the moon.

in short: religion, just like atheism doesnt have conclusive evidence to prove there is/isnt a God.
so whether your a bible/quran/veda basher or a smug atheist: stfu, nobody knows and let the subject drop.
As long as nobody tries to ram their viewpoints down other peoples throat we're all going to be fine.

RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 12:08 PM
Excuse my noobyness but I don't really understand where you guys are coming. I'm not trying prove the non-existence of God (I know, my argument isn't really positive Atheism then), I'm providing evidence that the Christian definition is wrong. The idea is that under their rules and mythology the Christian definition of God does not make sense.

@Mega Jesus-Sama: Can you explain why my arguments suck balls?

@Dr.Faustus:

1) It's not my definition. It the definition most Christians hold to be true.

2) I'm trying to disprove the definition.

RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 12:16 PM
@Lebell: Thank you for replying! I enjoy all feedback no matter how... colorful. I agree that I am new to this but I am happy to have all of you to beat some knowledge into me.

Lebell
29th May 12, 12:17 PM
so you're not a critic, not really an atheist, but just anti christian?
fuck you then.
thats discriminating.

'just the xtian god cant be true'
and the jewish, or islamic version can be?

oh wait...you know nothing about those so you cant judge, right?
idiot.

RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 12:44 PM
@Lebell:

I choose Christianity because It's the religion I know the most about (as I mentioned in my first post). Even if my claim could be proven to be correct, that would not mean I'm Anti Christian.

I admit that my title for this thread is misleading since my claim is not tied with Positive Atheism but I can't change the title now. Anyways, I apologize if I mislead you or anyone else who reads this.

Lebell
29th May 12, 12:58 PM
I'm not trying prove the non-existence of God (I know, my argument isn't really positive Atheism then), I'm providing evidence that the Christian definition is wrong. The idea is that under their rules and mythology the Christian definition of God does not make sense.

you're not anti christian, yet your atheistic crusade (lololol) focuses mainly on xtianity.
the xtian definition of God does not make any less sense than the others.

I think the problem here, if you're truely not discriminating against xtianity, is that you lack any understanding about it at all.

you're merely under the impression that you understand.

another quick crash course before i rlly head out:

first there were multiple gods.
jews came: ' sup, you peeps got it wrong, there's only one god, and guess who are his favorites? exactly! us! muahahaha!'
so there's this strict vengeful god and laadeedah.

at a certain point there's this rabbi named jesus who came with a completely different viewpoint: still one god, but god is about loving one's fellowman and taking care of eachother and about forgiveness and sacrifice.
also non jews can come to god.
Christianity is born.

then another 680 years later:
Uncle Mo comes by and says: lolwut? you fags are all wrong. you see, i was living up in a cave meditating and shit when i started to hear voices, then an angel started to dictate verses to me, eventhough i couldnt read and write, and guess what..entire pieces are direct flawed copies from the new testament!
god isnt love or mercy, he's a badass and whoever who is a true believer is better than any infadel and in fact, all true believers should kill the infadels cos that would plz god.

now outta those three, you really think xtianity is the most flawed?
plz jump in a fire.

RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 01:15 PM
Lebell, I have never claimed that Christianity is the most flawed religion. I am merely pointing out a flaw in one religion. You can probably find flaws in all religions if you look hard enough. By continuing to deflect the topic of discussion, you are simply affirming to me that my argument is correct. If you want argue, reply to the evidence I posited. Anything else is irrelevant and something, starting now, I will ignore.

AAAAAA
29th May 12, 02:41 PM
You should read Dawkins and Thomas Aquinas to better understand why you're being mocked here.

Robot Jesus
29th May 12, 02:52 PM
claiming to know there is no god is about as silly as claiming you know there is a god.

Pie of Hate
29th May 12, 03:59 PM
So far you have presented no evidence; only subjecture. You're points are no more than a rambling thought process than a well conceived argument.


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Feryk
29th May 12, 04:07 PM
Rick,

We have a few mega threads on this subject. Look up resolve's posts, you will get a helluva lot of discussion of the sky wizard, et al.

What people here are trying to tell you is that no matter what your position is on this subject, critical thinking is essential to this discussion - and your opening post doesn't have it.

Most of this has been discussed in detail. Try a search and some reading, and then by all means, let's fire this one up again.

Keep in mind you asked for critical feedback. Hope you don't take it personally.

nihilist
29th May 12, 04:11 PM
Here's a better argument for positive atheism.

1. A virgin would not take a pregancy test (http://theamericanjesus.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/mary-pregnancy-test.jpg)
2. Mary was not a virgin.
3. Therefore there is no god.

nihilist
29th May 12, 04:13 PM
Discuss.

Pie of Hate
29th May 12, 04:36 PM
Has anyone ever seen "The Man who Sued God"? Think it's an Aussie film.


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Craigypooh
29th May 12, 04:40 PM
I have skated by as a Negative Atheist, passing the burden of proof on Theists, for about a few years. I wanted to try my hand at Positive Atheist arguments.

Being an atheist means "not believing in God". You're starting off with a negative statement so it's quite hard to be positive.


I hope to provide evidence that the traditional view of the Christian God (the religion I am most versed in) is wrong.

The traditional view of the Christian God is unfalsifiable. God wants you to have freewill, therefore, He does not provide conclusive proof that He exists.



My evidence will be based on the assumption that the Bible is the accurate word of God and that God is all powerful, all knowing and benevolent.


That's not the traditional view of Christianity. The Catholic Church, for example, does not believe the bible is the accurate word of God.


I am looking for critical feedback.

You're probably in the wrong place.


Here I go:

1) If God is all powerful and all knowing, why would it use people as a primary method of transmitting it's message.


..for reasons you don't understand because you're not all knowing.



The obvious error is that humans are fallible and could easily interpret the message incorrectly. Thinking deeper you realize how flawed this method is. Go back to the origin of the Church. This all powerful, all knowing God depended on humans with very limited forms of transportation to spread it's message. While Christianity eventually spread all over the world, generations lived and died without even knowing Christianity existed. According to the bible, by not believing in the Christian God, these people committed the sin of Apostasy and would be sent to Hell for eternal torture. These people would suffer because of God's decision to use humans as the primary means to transmit It's message.

Perhaps that's not how it works and God just wants you to think that's how it works. Perhaps God made sure all the good people who deserved to go to heaven found out. Perhaps there's more going on than you understand because you're not all powerful.



2) The story of Noah's Ark.

In the time this story is set, there is one good man on the Earth surrounded by evil people. God wants to remove these evil people by creating a planet wide flood. Wait, what?! This is one the greatest examples of God not being all powerful, all knowing and benevolent. If God is all powerful, why didn't he just smite all the evil people or will them not to exist? On top of that, these evil people supposedly have young children among them. Are they evil too? Let me ignore this for a second and return to the story. God tasks the only Good man in the world to spend half of his life in hard labor to create the ark (very rewarding). God then commands animals to march two by two into the ark, there is a flood, etc. By using this flood, God kills all the evil people, all their innocent children and every land animal that wasn't in the ark. Were the animals evil too? The most important implication of this story is that despite God's flood evil people continue to inhabit the Earth. You may argue that God only wanted to balance the overpowering amount of evil on the earth. But if God is all powerful, why use a sloppy approach that kills innocent children and the majority of Earth's animals?

Perhaps God had a greater plan in mind, which you don't understand because you're not all powerful, and this was the best way to implement His plan.

Any suffering which Noah underwent was trivial compared to the joy he would have in heaven.

Perhaps this is just a story not to be taken literally.



3) It is impossible to be merciful and just.

God is portrayed to be merciful and just but those two concepts can not coexist. For example, let's say I am the most selfless and kind Atheist in the world. Compare this to Joe, who consistently commits various acts of murder, rape and torture. If Joe becomes a Christian in the last year of his life, all is forgiven and he gets to go to heaven. I, on the other hand, commit Apostasy and is sentenced to hell. This judgement grants mercy to Joe but is unmerciful to me and unjust to all parties.

This is your definition of justice and mercy and not God's.

Hope that helps.

Feryk
29th May 12, 04:46 PM
Nope. Haven`t seen it.

There is an arguement that many of the stories included in the bible are just their versions of myths that have been around for several thousand years. EG. The Garden of Eden myth (of which there may now be archaelogical evidence), but with Adam and Eve inserted.

The story of the flood may also have some historical truth. The bit about Noah and his Ark remain unproven, AFAIK.

Some hypothesize that Mary is a version of Isis stripped of her warlike tendencies.

Common threads exist throughout most religions. If there were a singular being that created the Universe, and he wanted us to know he or she existed then it follows that he`d be a bit more clear.

RickTheCritic
29th May 12, 04:52 PM
Thank you for all the responses! One quick comment.

@craigypooh:

Negative Atheism (or Weak Atheism): is simply the lack of belief in God/Gods.

Positive Atheism (or Strong Atheism): is the assertion that God/Gods do not exist.

@Everyone else: Thank you again for all the comments. I don't have time to look at them critically right now but I'll come up with a reply as soon as possible.

Lebell
30th May 12, 03:35 AM
p[lease don't.
you're obviously not intelligent enough to comprehend what the hell you are babbeling about and you also already 'threatened' to ignore certain viewpoints or reasoning.

If you stop this now we can all walk away and pretend this never happened.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
30th May 12, 06:46 AM
I'm providing evidence that the Christian definition is wrong. The idea is that under their rules and mythology the Christian definition of God does not make sense.

No you are criticising your definition of the Christian definition. You understand that right?


@Mega Jesus-Sama: Can you explain why my arguments suck balls?

He's projecting, he likes sucking balls


1) It's not my definition. It the definition most Christians hold to be true.

2) I'm trying to disprove the definition.

Nope as Craigypooh has pointed out your definition is not the Roman Catholic Church's definition and there are ~1.1 billion Catholics making them by far most Christians

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
30th May 12, 07:28 AM
Oh and Jesus loves you!

Lebell
30th May 12, 08:05 AM
be easy on the guy, he's prob 21 tops.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
30th May 12, 08:34 AM
Homeopathy kills more people than xtianity nowadays. It is the real problem.

I thought it was absentee fathers

Madgrenade
30th May 12, 08:53 AM
When the time is right the Aquarian Saviour will emerge, (Or a recent historical figure will be nominated the Aquarian saviour and a whole bunch of mythic rubbish will be written about him.) and the mythic aphorisms of the tarot will be repackaged for the modern era, as they were all those years ago at Nicea.

You see, your God is only as big as you make him, and two thousand years ago the Christian god was quite big enough. Now things are different. The size of the cosmos is beyond imagining, which makes an attempt to comprehend a one true God to fit is extremely difficult. Now with the revelations that the the universe, although vast beyond ken of men, is also very tightly linked on the most subtle levels, giving the possibility (probability?) that we are all still a singularity on some level gives plenty of scope for extremely taxing and rigorous theological, philosophical and scientific theoriseing and investigation.

All this is of course extremely terrifying prospect for any preist of the modern churches of ignorance. Because stargazing, honest dreaming and quantum physics aren't their cup of tea. The prefer boy rape and squeezing the congregation for everything they are worth. Their heads would probably explode if they really tried to get their head around a God in this day and age.

So while ancient dogma may be repugnent the same old myths and archetypes still apply. Somewhere in this world there are heroes battling impossible odds. Somewhere right now there is a saviour laying down his life for a lost cause. We still have evil wizards in tall towers. We still battle duality on a daily basis, struggling for the whole. The Holy.

So cry foul and claim there is no God if you wish. But you diminish yourself, slaying the God in you, and never investigating that part of yourself that is rooted in the unseen discovered, the unseen discoverable, and the unseen undiscoverable.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
30th May 12, 09:02 AM
You see, your God is only as big as you make him.

GOD (TM everything) is everything therefore it is the biggest thing by definition.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
30th May 12, 09:04 AM
No. You can't talk bad about those because the highest percentages are in the african american community. That would make you racist. Homeopathy is a white people thing, so it is ok to knock it.

Dint realise you were black!

Feryk
30th May 12, 11:11 AM
Just his anus.

You know, the same thing Madgrenade is talking out of.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
30th May 12, 11:50 AM
I quite liked his mini Tarot rant, that was fun.

Feryk
30th May 12, 11:54 AM
I'd like to see him make a different thread about the environmental issues he sees as being more important than AGW. With references, etc.

Spade: The Real Snake
30th May 12, 12:39 PM
Is Aquaman a man gifted with the abilities of a fish or a fish gifted with the abilities of a man?

Madgrenade
30th May 12, 02:44 PM
Essentially the Aquarian Saviour should represent the highest aspirations and ideals of the day and carry those ideals into the future.

So a more pertinent question would be what qualities and powers should Aquaman have in order to quide the principles of the new age of the star and the future precessional period as we travel through the Aquarius sign?

Spade: The Real Snake
30th May 12, 03:21 PM
a less-ghey costume, for starters.

Lebell
31st May 12, 05:20 AM
Jesus said, "I shall give you what no eye has seen and what no ear has heard and what no hand has touched and what has never occurred to the human mind."

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
31st May 12, 05:31 AM
kjxSCAalsBE

Lebell
31st May 12, 06:56 AM
they should make a musical about Jesus, that would be a hit.
Like, Jesus Christ, megafamous.

Lebell
31st May 12, 06:57 AM
or a remake of Fame, but then with Jesus!

FAME! im gonna live foreverrrrrrr no cross is holding me down.,..FAME!

catchy!

Spade: The Real Snake
31st May 12, 08:07 AM
well there is that shitty Steve Coogan movie about "swimmer's body Jesus"

Feryk
31st May 12, 12:26 PM
....and yet another thread successfully derailed.

Congratulations, everyone. Good work all the way around.

Harpy
31st May 12, 04:41 PM
"Ain't no homos gonna make it to heaven" - 4 year old performing at his church (Apostolic Truth Tabernacle...never heard of it) in Greensburg, Indiana, America (fnck yeah!)

Spade: The Real Snake
31st May 12, 04:43 PM
"Ain't no homos gonna make it to heaven" - 4 year old performing at his church (Apostolic Truth Tabernacle...never heard of it) in Greensburg, Indiana, America (fnck yeah!)
It's like the movie Red State comin' to life.
PRAZE JEBUZ!

Madgrenade
31st May 12, 04:49 PM
I in no way encourage the derailment of this thread. But I would exchange positive atheism with positive retheism and judeo christian aquarian gnosis.

nihilist
1st June 12, 06:13 AM
Is Aquaman a man gifted with the abilities of a fish or a fish gifted with the abilities of a man?

He was the lesser known son gifted by god to walk on under water.

Harpy
1st June 12, 07:08 AM
You're dragging my name through mud.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
1st June 12, 07:36 AM
....and yet another thread successfully derailed.

Congratulations, everyone. Good work all the way around.

Well to be fair Mr Cleric kinda folded after the first salvo.

Fortunantly we picked up a new ager to fill lebell's void.

Aquaman loves you Ferky!!

Spade: The Real Snake
1st June 12, 08:09 AM
judeo
Cheap and easy to find at the "Y"

nihilist
1st June 12, 09:42 AM
Stop dragging my heart around.

nihilist
1st June 12, 09:47 AM
I think you guys are missing the more important philosophical question here which is why Allah and Yahweh can't get along.

Lebell
1st June 12, 10:10 AM
penorsize.

Madgrenade
1st June 12, 10:18 AM
Say what you like about Mohammed (PBUH), or not as the case may be, (Thats "or not" as in you may not be able say what you like about Mohammed (PBUH) not that peace may or may not be upon him, which it clearly has been stated is.) the problem with Islam is that the prophets archetype is, essentially heroic.

Here is a man who raised armies, took towns, chopped heads of evildoers and apostates and generally all round got what he wanted.

He was also a genuine historic figure.

Whereas the saviour archetype wore common of gnostic, coded traditions is usally getting fucked up and not having a great time of it before his inevitable ultimate sacrifice.

Having the spiritual icon of your cult as a saviour makes it a lot more appealing, hence the enduring image of the saviour througout ancient history, with christ solophism forming the basis of many cults and religious orders.

It is my belief that Islam is the product of Arabian mystery scholars, probably based in Medina, attemping to stop the pernicious spread of the Roman mystery schools and European dogma from spreading into their lands and usurping their tribal power. So in setting up their rival cult they used a rival archetype, the hero, and when a young, rejected prophet from the next city came over they had the perfect material for a spirtual hero. And they didn't do a bad job because the ideals of their cult became a dominant world religion.

nihilist
1st June 12, 10:53 AM
Say what you like about Mohammed (PBUH), or not as the case may be, (Thats "or not" as in you may not be able say what you like about Mohammed (PBUH) not that peace may or may not be upon him, which it clearly has been stated is.) the problem with Islam is that the prophets archetype is, essentially heroic.

Here is a man who raised armies, took towns, chopped heads of evildoers and apostates and generally all round got what he wanted.

He was also a genuine historic figure.

Whereas the saviour archetype wore common of gnostic, coded traditions is usally getting fucked up and not having a great time of it before his inevitable ultimate sacrifice.

Having the spiritual icon of your cult as a saviour makes it a lot more appealing, hence the enduring image of the saviour througout ancient history, with christ solophism forming the basis of many cults and religious orders.

It is my belief that Islam is the product of Arabian mystery scholars, probably based in Medina, attemping to stop the pernicious spread of the Roman mystery schools and European dogma from spreading into their lands and usurping their tribal power. So in setting up their rival cult they used a rival archetype, the hero, and when a young, rejected prophet from the next city came over they had the perfect material for a spirtual hero. And they didn't do a bad job because the ideals of their cult became a dominant world religion.

I see you carefully avoided the big question.

Lebell
1st June 12, 10:54 AM
Say what you like about Mohammed (PBUH), or not as the case may be, (Thats "or not" as in you may not be able say what you like about Mohammed (PBUH) not that peace may or may not be upon him, which it clearly has been stated is.) the problem with Islam is that the prophets archetype is, essentially heroic.

Here is a man who raised armies, took towns, chopped heads of evildoers and apostates and generally all round got what he wanted.

He was also a genuine historic figure.

Whereas the saviour archetype wore common of gnostic, coded traditions is usally getting fucked up and not having a great time of it before his inevitable ultimate sacrifice.

Having the spiritual icon of your cult as a saviour makes it a lot more appealing, hence the enduring image of the saviour througout ancient history, with christ solophism forming the basis of many cults and religious orders.

It is my belief that Islam is the product of Arabian mystery scholars, probably based in Medina, attemping to stop the pernicious spread of the Roman mystery schools and European dogma from spreading into their lands and usurping their tribal power. So in setting up their rival cult they used a rival archetype, the hero, and when a young, rejected prophet from the next city came over they had the perfect material for a spirtual hero. And they didn't do a bad job because the ideals of their cult became a dominant world religion.

no.
it is a response to judaism and xtianity.
an arab counterversion.
this is why islam is an arabcentered religion.
amongst muslims there is racism.

arabs are the chosen people.

its all about jealousy etc.
its a crude response to a changing world: you gotta be like us or die, things gotta remain the way they were damnit!

and its still working like that to this very day.
this is why you simply CANT have progress under islam because islam is contra improvement or free thought.

Madgrenade
1st June 12, 11:13 AM
no.
it is a response to judaism and xtianity.
an arab counterversion.
this is why islam is an arabcentered religion.
amongst muslims there is racism.

arabs are the chosen people.

its all about jealousy etc.
its a crude response to a changing world: you gotta be like us or die, things gotta remain the way they were damnit!

and its still working like that to this very day.
this is why you simply CANT have progress under islam because islam is contra improvement or free thought.

Thats kinda what I said.

What big question have I carefully avoided?

Lebell
1st June 12, 11:17 AM
Thats kinda what I said.

What big question have I carefully avoided?

you had too much nuance.

first of all, uncle Mo never was a hero.
the first muslims already weaseled around in pretty much the same manner as they still do today where they are the minority.

i see it more as a plague than as a movement.

despair and every form of poverty follow in their wake.

nihilist
1st June 12, 11:26 AM
What big question have I carefully avoided?

pnrsz.

Madgrenade
1st June 12, 11:29 AM
Maybe he isn't a hero to you but he certainly is to very many people.

Plus I am referring to how he fits into the hero, as opposed to saviour, archetype, not if he was an actual "hero" in terms of being an all round jolly chap.

As evidenced being an all round jolly chap is more a saviour archetypes method of being, wheras a hero can be slightly more morally ambiguous as he battles duality within and without. A heros defining charactersitic is adherance to a cause which HE believes is right and following that through to the end. And in that Mo fits.

Madgrenade
1st June 12, 11:41 AM
pnrsz.

Well this is certainly an important question. But I believe a simple answer to the overiding issue in this case is that no matter how big the universe gets there will never be enough room for two One True Gods.

KO'd N DOA
1st June 12, 11:54 AM
. I, on the other hand, commit Apostasy and is sentenced to hell.

AMEN

Lebell
1st June 12, 12:08 PM
A heros defining charactersitic is adherance to a cause which HE believes is right and following that through to the end. And in that Mo fits.

devils verses.
hadith contradicting quranic verses.

read a fucking book.

Madgrenade
1st June 12, 12:29 PM
devils verses.
hadith contradicting quranic verses.

read a fucking book.

For someone with such a clear hatred of Islam you seem quite enamoured with their heresy. Hey I love poetry too.

But it's writing a fucking book we need to be concerning ourselves with now.

Cullion
1st June 12, 03:02 PM
Madgrenade, I am intrigued by your ideas and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

nihilist
1st June 12, 11:41 PM
He's abandoned the newsletter idea in favor of a career in fiction.

Adouglasmhor
2nd June 12, 02:25 AM
plus your arguments suck balls tbh

And MJS know quite a bit about sucking balls.

Adouglasmhor
2nd June 12, 02:29 AM
Has anyone ever seen "The Man who Sued God"? Think it's an Aussie film.


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It is, stars Billy Connolly pretty funny.

Pie of Hate
2nd June 12, 03:43 AM
It was a great film and raised a interesting dilemma for the church and the court. Billy played a cracker too.


Sent from my Fembot4000 using Tapatalk

Lebell
2nd June 12, 05:22 AM
For someone with such a clear hatred of Islam you seem quite enamoured with their heresy. Hey I love poetry too.

But it's writing a fucking book we need to be concerning ourselves with now.

I dont HATE islam, its more like annoying.
islam is like a ugly fat dumb baby, and imagine how people are constantly shoving this ugly baby in front of your nose and talking about it like its the new einstein, and you dont wanna hurt their feelings but deep down inside you just wanna grab the baby and yell: ITS A FUCKING MORON, AND NOTHING WILL COME OF HIM! and then beat its little fat fucking face against a wall like it deserves.

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 05:43 AM
He's abandoned the newsletter idea in favor of a career in fiction.

Well creative writing was always my stronger point rather than the hefty stodge of acedemia.

SO the new book will be a work of fiction. And what fiction! All the oldies but goldies will be there, a book of moral tales so compelling with a main character so righteous that Jesus himself will be begging for salvation.

But thats just on the surface. Encoded into the text will be the knowledge of the age. From the constituent particles of atoms to the periodic table of the elements. From physical formulas to instructions on how to build basic silicon processors. Some simple, universal ideas will be anthromorphisised and incorporated directly into the narratives. Other, more complex technology will be hard coded into the text and require some study and intelligence. The more complex the technology, the harder the code.

Kind of a knowledge ark that can float through any fall and sail out the other side shiny. Just as the ancients left the design for an ocean going craft in the story of Noahs ark, so we must be able to leave our technological and philosopical heritage for future generations. And considering that we have much more of both then the coding idea is ideal, unless u want a book the size of encyclopedia Brittanica*. It all needs to fit inside a tome that someone would actually try to preserve in a time of crisis.

* It's worth mentioning that 2012 will be the last year a printed version of encyclopedi Brittanica is printed into hardback books. Apparently in all the exited rush to the digital age we dont need to write things down anymore. I hope everyone sees the opvious peril here. If the sum of human knowledge is lost because of a harddisk corruption or a catastrophe that destroys our capacity to read our electronic storage devices we will loose so much knowledge in a single generation. Sure we can remember some of the basics, but there are so many formulas and bits of knowledge that cumalatively make up the tech level we have today. If all the brainiacs get killed or run off to hide under some moutain, were gonna need an indestructable knowledge bomb to give the brainiacs of the future a fighting chance.

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 06:07 AM
I dont HATE islam, its more like annoying.
islam is like a ugly fat dumb baby, and imagine how people are constantly shoving this ugly baby in front of your nose and talking about it like its the new einstein, and you dont wanna hurt their feelings but deep down inside you just wanna grab the baby and yell: ITS A FUCKING MORON, AND NOTHING WILL COME OF HIM! and then beat its little fat fucking face against a wall like it deserves.

Well mate we are in agreement, I think I just have a milder way of putting it. I think however that the main problem is that Islam is being used now as an weapon against EVERYONE, muslim or not, by the same vested interests that are making the world such a precarious place (more by design than accident, tho a bit of both.) The thing that frustrates me most about "radical" Muslims who want to spread the faith is that their entire religious structure has been infiltrated to the most highest level by the same infidel scum they keep whining about. This conflict between the old faiths is perhaps the greatest example of a duality battle on the face of the earth today. And not without reason. The entire groupmind conciousness of both civilisations has been manipulated into beliveing in this destined epic battle of mythic proportions, each beliving that God is on their side and the other is the transgressor. Dancing to the tune of the mythic manipulators who play idealolgies and loyalties of men like hot chicks play the violin. And we will still be fighting each other when they exit stage left, job done, with all the swag. Again.

Lebell
2nd June 12, 06:15 AM
Well mate we are in agreement, I think I just have a milder way of putting it. I think however that the main problem is that Islam is being used now as an weapon against EVERYONE, muslim or not, by the same vested interests that are making the world such a precarious place (more by design than accident, tho a bit of both.) The thing that frustrates me most about "radical" Muslims who want to spread the faith is that their entire religious structure has been infiltrated to the most highest level by the same infidel scum they keep whining about. This conflict between the old faiths is perhaps the greatest example of a duality battle on the face of the earth today. And not without reason. The entire groupmind conciousness of both civilisations has been manipulated into beliveing in this destined epic battle of mythic proportions, each beliving that God is on their side and the other is the transgressor. Dancing to the tune of the mythic manipulators who play idealolgies and loyalties of men like hot chicks play the violin. And we will still be fighting each other when they exit stage left, job done, with all the swag. Again.

islam is being used now?
the islam is designed like that, its only purpose is for this.
islam is a faith for losers, so they can still feel high and mighty.


if you read in on the history of the spread of islam you will see a disturbing pattern, that continues to this very day: they spread out, at first they are relatively quiet cos a minority, then from the inside out they wreak havoc.
ask the byzantines.

they will not stop or reason, they only follow their perverted religion.

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 06:29 AM
Hey, when I think of Christianity VS Islam I always think how Christianity united a bunch of barbaric disparate tribesmen and turned them into the greatest civilisation on Earth, wheras Islam managed to turn the greatest civilisation on Earth into a bunch of barbaric, disparate tribesmen. I have no wish to see the further spread of this church of ignorance.

But know this, neither dogma has allowed to common folk to glimpse but one tenth of the spiritual gnostic heritage that is your right by birth. Sure we get little snippets, but for most people thier religion, and hence their spirit, is lost in murky ancient allegory.

I am suggesting that we open the spiritual flood gates and make the link between spirit and science with learning, so that anyone who wants to can hear the message for what it is, a message of hope for the future, that a man can be greater than the sum of his parts. Not the threat of damnation over non compliance.

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 09:02 AM
Riddick WHO?

nihilist
2nd June 12, 09:17 AM
Jesus was actually a cyborg.

Think about it.

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 09:49 AM
I am actually a cyborg troll.

Think about it.

I have.

nihilist
2nd June 12, 09:54 AM
Resistance is futile.

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 10:30 AM
They didn't have cybernetics in those days.
He was a golem.

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 11:03 AM
Dammit I am not Riddeck! And Jesus was not a golem.

Although a golem is an archetype. A clay man. A hollow man with no thoughts of his own, who needs words put into his head by others to function. With nothing of substance to add.

I wonder who fits that model....

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 11:12 AM
Dammit I am not Riddeck! And Jesus was not a golem.

Although a golem is an archetype. A clay man. A hollow man with no thoughts of his own, who needs words put into his head by others to function. With nothing of substance to add.

I wonder who fits that model....
He was "the son of God"....with no real mother or father.

His purpose was merely to die on earth and cleanse the sins of man, so they might live in divinity in the hereafter.

That fits the definition.

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 11:23 AM
Not really. Jesus had a Holy mother and a loving "father" in Joseph. He preached from the heart a message of peace for all man, and an intolerance of corruption. He selflessly gave his life or his own free will and had the courage to wait in the Garden knowing it would lead to his doom. He represents the saviour and the hanged man. No golem.

Mythically speaking of course.

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 12:19 PM
He was programmed and sent to perform all these preordained actions

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 12:41 PM
He was programmed and sent to perform all these preordained actions

Right.

Are you really having trouble getting what I'm getting at?

Or are you being a silly twat?

I think I know.

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 12:45 PM
I didn't know barking loons could be such sensitive, delicate bitches

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 12:55 PM
I didn't know barking loons could be such sensitive, delicate bitches

Hey I'm not HIM. I'm just HIS messanger. And HE told me to tell you to pull your fucking head out your arse. You seem intent on derailing and shitting all over every thread on the forum. Why not fuck off back to CTC and leave the reasoned discussion to the adults, eh?

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 01:43 PM
Hey I'm not HIM. I'm just HIS messanger. And HE told me to tell you to pull your fucking head out your arse. You seem intent on derailing and shitting all over every thread on the forum. Why not fuck off back to CTC and leave the reasoned discussion to the adults, eh?
you just did a fine, fine job of demonstrating the "reasoned discussion" when left in the hands of the "adults", eh.

Why don't you post something other than the garden-variety copypasta from infowars or weatherwars or the Jessie "the Body" Ventura discussion board?

Madgrenade
2nd June 12, 02:05 PM
you just did a fine, fine job of demonstrating the "reasoned discussion" when left in the hands of the "adults", eh.

Why don't you post something other than the garden-variety copypasta from infowars or weatherwars or the Jessie "the Body" Ventura discussion board?

First I must congratulate you on a two sentance post. Things are certainly looking up.

Second I think I at least make a crack at a reasoned debate. I have provided two lengthy posts on environmental issues that I belive are more important than AGW, as requested, with references, as requested. If you have any issue with any studies referenced in the sources provided I will be happy to investigate and provide alternative links if necessary. As to copy pasta Infowars, while I may make references to sources also referenced by Infowars all the text written in my articles is written by me tap tap tapping away, so I'm not sure that copypasta allegations apply, unless referencing arguments is copypasta. I'm pretty sure that referencing boldly stated and controversial points is encouraged in this forum. Perhaps I was mistaken.

Thirdly, I cant even argue a third point because you only included two sentances. Athough this is of course much better than your usual average of a few nonsenceical words and a meme. so my third point is my first point.

Don't get me wrong, I think you're a funny guy sometimes. But not everything in this world is a laughing matter.

Lebell
2nd June 12, 03:54 PM
exactly.
like rape is never funny (unless you're dressed as a clown).

Spade: The Real Snake
2nd June 12, 11:31 PM
Don't get me wrong, I think you're a funny guy sometimes. But not everything in this world is a laughing matter.
make yourself worthy

Madgrenade
3rd June 12, 04:52 AM
make yourself worthy

Still not giving me much to work with.

What are your opinions on the concept of positive retheism as postulated here? Do you have any arquements for positive atheism?

Discuss.

Lebell
3rd June 12, 06:54 AM
he's an american, yet you expect an informed opinion?

L to the O to the L.

Spade: The Real Snake
3rd June 12, 08:41 AM
Why would you devote so much time, energy and concern into the creation of categories and labels of other's beliefs, unless you are so insecure in your own, that you seek the safe, calm confines of knowing you can rest easily with other people defined.

Madgrenade
3rd June 12, 11:37 AM
ummm... because its a freaking discussion forum?

I was just wondering if you had anything constructive to add? But don't worry if you don't. Its fine, really. Some holes are just so deep and dark no matter how much light you shine down there it will never be properly illuminated.

Lebell
3rd June 12, 12:30 PM
ummm... because its a freaking discussion forum?

I was just wondering if you had anything constructive to add? But don't worry if you don't. Its fine, really. Some holes are just so deep and dark no matter how much light you shine down there it will never be properly illuminated.

Yeah tell me about it, ive dated black women too.

Cullion
3rd June 12, 01:16 PM
no, you didn't 'date' them.

nihilist
3rd June 12, 10:28 PM
'dating' = porking.

Harpy
3rd June 12, 11:27 PM
'Date raping' = Lebell romancing

Spade: The Real Snake
4th June 12, 12:10 AM
Lebell Dating = hidden cameras

Harpy
4th June 12, 12:32 AM
Crouching hunchback, Hidden penor

nihilist
4th June 12, 01:54 AM
'dances with jews'

Harpy
4th June 12, 02:10 AM
Lebell's List

Harpy
4th June 12, 02:15 AM
The Merchant of Lolland

Lebell
4th June 12, 03:59 AM
'Can do Casanova'

Spade: The Real Snake
4th June 12, 11:08 AM
All hat, no cattle

Feryk
4th June 12, 02:21 PM
How to see Europe of $5 a day.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
5th June 12, 05:57 AM
Must say I'm warming to Madgranade

Harpy
5th June 12, 06:11 AM
Must say I'm warming to MadgranadeGhey.

Feryk - hahahah, classic.

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
5th June 12, 06:13 AM
Fuck off u fat lezza

Spade: The Real Snake
5th June 12, 09:32 AM
Must say I'm warming to Madgranade
what a pity that he won't feel the sting of your witty retorts....

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
5th June 12, 10:22 AM
Fuck off u fat lezza

Feryk
5th June 12, 05:01 PM
I see your 'Fuck off' list is expanding.

wondering when your 'Ignore' list will start growing too.

Spade: The Real Snake
5th June 12, 08:42 PM
the faggot Dr. Max Fatass craves too much attention to EVER dare use the ignore feature.

Harpy
5th June 12, 10:15 PM
Max Pen - wanna go full lezza with me?

Omg - the former fat girl turned pretty girl in my team is way annoying. While someone was having their lunch she starts spraying her desk down with commercial cleaning products. Also she's stupid and was telling me about her new 'low carb' diet plan and has no freaking clue. She opened the lolly box then stopped herself from eating bemoaning the fact it didn't contain healthy food. I'm sitting there wanting to flick her across the face for being whiny.

Hedley LaMarr
5th June 12, 10:22 PM
The ignore function is great. Some of the best times can be had on this forum by ignoring everybody.

Spade: The Real Snake
5th June 12, 10:51 PM
Max Pen - wanna go full lezza with me?
No.


Omg - the former fat girl turned pretty girl in my team is way annoying. While someone was having their lunch she starts spraying her desk down with commercial cleaning products. Also she's stupid and was telling me about her new 'low carb' diet plan and has no freaking clue. She opened the lolly box then stopped herself from eating bemoaning the fact it didn't contain healthy food. I'm sitting there wanting to flick her across the face for being whiny.
Now you two Ozzy harlots are welcome to a little aggressive reverse cowgirl scissoring action
and post-up the vidz for all the boyz to enjoy.

Harpy
5th June 12, 11:13 PM
I've begun to ignore her. Yesterday it was wet weather and she was angling for a ride home. I pretended to not hear. The weather forecast says rain all week and the dumbass doesn't bring an umbrella. Plus she dances in s group of middle-aged biddies, has no friends her age (she's 26) and produces sub-standard work. Which reminds me, never get stuck walking with her because you need to initiate every conversation or suffer awkward silence or some inane topic.

Spade: The Real Snake
5th June 12, 11:48 PM
I've begun to ignore her. Yesterday it was wet weather and she was angling for a ride home. I pretended to not hear. The weather forecast says rain all week and the dumbass doesn't bring an umbrella. Plus she dances in s group of middle-aged biddies, has no friends her age (she's 26) and produces sub-standard work. Which reminds me, never get stuck walking with her because you need to initiate every conversation or suffer awkward silence or some inane topic.
>..<
ME-OW
kitty's got claws!

Harpy
5th June 12, 11:55 PM
It's one of those days, know what I mean? And no, I don't mean PMS.

Oh god, that's another thing she speaks about. Her constipation and her rags, somebody kill her plz.

Harpy
6th June 12, 12:02 AM
There's more. She asked me if I could sing and I just muttered something along the lines of 'passably well' and then she started in on how talented she was and all the school productions she had been in. I couldn't give a fuck and in that moment I wish Zeus could have lighted her and other pretentious/entitled/emotionally needy Gen Ys.

Or maybe I'm finally 'old' and cranky

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
6th June 12, 05:23 AM
the fantastic Dr. Maxnificant craves too much attention to EVER dare use the ignore feature.

This is true^^

Harpy
6th June 12, 06:21 AM
^ name change to Dr Moranis plz

Lebell
6th June 12, 06:43 AM
Im going to marry Lily one fine day.
She'll be at her office trying to ignore her annoying coworker and then I come in, wearing a white navy uniform and on a motorcycle to steal her away..

*sigh*

Spade: The Real Snake
6th June 12, 07:46 AM
uh-oh.
looks like Capt. Lubby: Cracker Jack, is wanting a little scissoring, too.

nihilist
6th June 12, 10:23 AM
I do not have female parts, but I can still scissor with the best of them. (http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/0911/pleasure-scissoring-demotivational-poster-1259457948.jpg)

Harpy
6th June 12, 03:30 PM
http://truebloodnet.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/normal_003.jpg

Lebell - how do you fit on a motorbike? Do your knees drag on the road?

Spade: The Real Snake
6th June 12, 03:57 PM
Lebell: Putting the "Fag" in "Faggy White Uniform"

Harpy
6th June 12, 04:32 PM
Come now Tomm Crewz, you love the dress whites and you know it!

Spade: The Real Snake
6th June 12, 05:12 PM
I thought your new University Boyfriend was Thom Cruz

Harpy
6th June 12, 05:39 PM
Ewwww, he's just on my project team.

Can we can get back to Eric Northman?

Spade: The Real Snake
6th June 12, 05:59 PM
has the bloom already fallen from the rose....so soon?

Spade: The Real Snake
6th June 12, 06:00 PM
FUCK OFF FAT LEZZAS!!!

Dr. Socially Liberal Fiscally Conservative Vermin
7th June 12, 04:10 AM
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!! !!!!!!!!!

Lebell
7th June 12, 05:07 AM
http://truebloodnet.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/11/normal_003.jpg

Lebell - how do you fit on a motorbike? Do your knees drag on the road?

No but motorcycles are really uncomfortable to me.
Because my legs are bent in a really shitty angle, in India Idrove those hero hondas, awfull bikes.
Also I learned that me and driving vehicles isnt a very good combination, it's like GTA, Iget instant suicidal tendencies.(according to others, to me its 'flexibel driving')

Spade: The Real Snake
7th June 12, 08:00 AM
I see Aunt Lubby wearing a blue sailor suit, riding a unicycle.
Like a chimp in a circus.

Madgrenade
7th June 12, 08:34 AM
This forum has become the most retarded crock of shit on the web. Congrats everyone!

Lebell
7th June 12, 08:46 AM
let's make it more interesting.

JLkBo55OTko

when you see the intro, the first few seconds you can see a modern building with a square 'hole' in it, right next to it is my regular bar over there.

Madgrenade
7th June 12, 09:01 AM
Fucking rapture. This is precisely why a greater spiritual understanding is needed among all people. The churches need to be providing hope and teaching, not literalisms.

60 million fucking "left behind"" films sold in USA? Damn self fulfilling prophecy kicking in to overdrive. Get your tinned hats on and your tinned food in cos if America melts down all these Christians are gonna be a bit miffed when God doesn't swoop down and lift them out of the shitstorm.

It just makes me realise the scale of the challenges we face.

Lebell
7th June 12, 10:08 AM
one time I took a pee in an alley on the side of the via delorosa, am I going to hell?

Spade: The Real Snake
7th June 12, 10:19 AM
Fucking rapture. This is precisely why a greater spiritual understanding is needed among all people. The churches need to be providing hope and teaching, not literalisms.

60 million fucking "left behind"" films sold in USA? Damn self fulfilling prophecy kicking in to overdrive. Get your tinned hats on and your tinned food in cos if America melts down all these Christians are gonna be a bit miffed when God doesn't swoop down and lift them out of the shitstorm.

It just makes me realise the scale of the challenges we face.

If it weren't for Left Behind, we would never have had Fireproof.

Madgrenade
7th June 12, 11:26 AM
Never doubted you'd be a fan Max. Suddenly the world is making more sense.

Spade: The Real Snake
7th June 12, 11:28 AM
Never doubted you'd be a fan Max. Suddenly the world is making more sense.
If it weren't for Fireproof, we would never have had Courageous