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Kein Haar
13th July 10, 08:45 PM
http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/31yS1Pzvb7L._SS500_.jpg

http://www.amazon.com/Mauviel-Cuprinox-Extra-Thick-Round-Frying/dp/B00022M30Q/ref=pd_sbs_k_2

So I bought mah momz one of these things.

#1. Compared to stainless, you don't need nearly as much heat blasting underneath, since it conducts so well.

#2. You don't have to wait nearly as long for it TO heat up.

#3. You can put the flame on the one end, and the heat conducts equally well on the opposite side many inches away....as tested with drops of water.

So worth it. I'm gonna get me sum at later date.

WarPhalange
13th July 10, 09:11 PM
Holy shit that's expensive.

Kein Haar
13th July 10, 09:35 PM
I wouldn't have bought it for myself based on the price. But I needed to splurge on something for her.

Turns out I covet this.

Ajamil
13th July 10, 09:37 PM
Not to be confused with the pusher's cookware.

http://lancaster.unl.edu/family/images/MethLab.jpg

(Sorry! It looked like a spoon to me at first.)

Kein Haar
13th July 10, 09:40 PM
That looks like a pretty respectable set-up.

Dark Helmet
13th July 10, 10:32 PM
I swear I read the title as "Cockware". But reading it again....I think you should have gone with Cockware instead.

Kein Haar
13th July 10, 10:38 PM
Modz? Change title plz.

WarPhalange
13th July 10, 11:12 PM
Let me get this straight. You bought your mamz a $300 piece of metal that heats up more evenly. Not a phone, or something useful. No. Just a piece of metal. Some son you are.

Kein Haar
13th July 10, 11:17 PM
Of all people you should understand the interesting fizix of it.

Ajamil
13th July 10, 11:29 PM
Let me get this straight. You bought your mamz a $300 piece of metal that heats up more evenly. Not a phone, or something useful. No. Just a piece of metal. Some son you are.As Kiko would be glad to demonstrate, that is also an effective melee weapon.

Ragout
13th July 10, 11:55 PM
As Kiko would be glad to demonstrate, that is also an effective melee weapon.

I dunno, a $20 aluminum baseball bat would do the job, and you would still have about $300 left to buy cleaning supplies and a shovel to take care of the body.

fes_fsa
14th July 10, 01:11 AM
Modz? Change title plz.

done.

Steve
14th July 10, 01:26 AM
done.

Be aware of what shows up on the front page, pls.

fes_fsa
14th July 10, 01:41 AM
i forgot. sorry about that.

Steve
14th July 10, 01:57 AM
np at all. Let me know if you want me to call you still, I'll be up for just about an hour.

Steve
14th July 10, 01:59 AM
np at all. Let me know if you want me to call you still, I'll be up for just about an hour.

Unless my phone is currently charging cause it's dead, which it is.

Harpy
14th July 10, 02:00 AM
*vomit*

WarPhalange
14th July 10, 02:11 AM
Of all people you should understand the interesting fizix of it.

Oh I do. It's pretty basic. They slapped some copper on that bitch and called it a day. There is no way to justify that price.

Still, not as ridiculous as this:

http://www.amazon.com/AudioQuest-K2-terminated-speaker-cable/dp/B000J36XR2/ref=cm_cr_pr_sims_t

Read the reviews. Hilarious.

Kein Haar
14th July 10, 02:29 AM
Please explain that.

WarPhalange
14th July 10, 02:31 AM
Explain what?

Kein Haar
14th July 10, 02:33 AM
Those wires.

WarPhalange
14th July 10, 02:51 AM
They are supposed to transmit signals better for higher quality audio. In reality however, it doesn't matter because the difference between them and regular old aluminum or copper wires is negligible. In fact, I've never seen fancy cables used in any research lab. So the price is just to catch morons with more money than they know what to do with.

Kiko
14th July 10, 04:47 AM
As Kiko would be glad to demonstrate, that is also an effective melee weapon.

Especially if it was given as a gift from my kids or husband!

Kein Haar
14th July 10, 04:50 AM
Maybe someone can just back me up on the superiority of snooty french cooking ware.

Kiko
14th July 10, 05:00 AM
Depends what you're gonna cook. If it's just eggs, that will be a pain in the ass, everything will stick and it'll be a bitch to clean.

Gimme non-stick or I'll give you a pan upside yo' head!

Kein Haar
14th July 10, 06:37 AM
It's pretty easy to make anything not stick on stainless. My omellettes slide out effortlessly without exception.

You just have to be not a retard.

SFGOON
14th July 10, 06:41 AM
I'm sorry man, but most metals have the same molar specific heat. I think the France pan maker just charged you extra for a thin pan.

There's nothing special about that cookware at a molecular level. I hate to break it to you but it's the truth.

It's the same kind of metallic lattice they use at the homeless shelter.

Kiko
14th July 10, 07:22 AM
Retard?
A fool and his money, eh?

MrGalt
15th July 10, 07:56 AM
http://www.royalprestige.com/Products/RoyalPrestige/Cookware/Sets/9-Ply/Code-CO7322/7-piece-Classic-Cooking-System.aspx

We got some of this stuff for our wedding a few years ago. It's just about in the same price range. It's actually pretty amazing...exactly what it says on the tin. Non-stick without teflon, cooks fast with very low heat input, and when we managed to destroy one we just called them and they sent us another and paid the postage for the return.

And now everything in my kitchen came from the 100 yen store. FML.

Good on you for taking care of your mom, Kein.

resolve
15th July 10, 08:05 AM
That's the first website I've seen to use MS Silverlight.

EvilSteve
15th July 10, 08:09 AM
Those wires.


If there is one cable I would whole-heartedly trust to my Chimera-hunting needs, this would be the cable. No other cable has the tensile strength to properly and efficiently garrote a lycanthrope, asphyxiate an Esquilax or even gag a mermaid. Last week, using my trusty AudioQuest K2 (retrofitted with lead weights, bright orange latex paint and a generous coating of crushed glass stolen from the window of an abandoned church at midnight), I managed to snuff 3 golden unicorns in swift succession!

There you go.

As for copper cookware, I have a couple of pieces of Mauviel. They do heat far more quickly and evenly than my Calphalon and if you're doing something fairly temperature sensitive like a beurre monte it does make your life easier, but for most applications I'll go with nonstick just for cleanup reasons. I do use my 8" copper for omelets though. It took some getting used to because of the heat transference, but they are nice pans.

WarPhalange
15th July 10, 12:01 PM
I'm sorry man, but most metals have the same molar specific heat. I think the France pan maker just charged you extra for a thin pan.

There's nothing special about that cookware at a molecular level. I hate to break it to you but it's the truth.

It's the same kind of metallic lattice they use at the homeless shelter.

Fuck yeah, dude, high five!

Ming Loyalist
15th July 10, 12:27 PM
we got a set of copper all-clad for our wedding and while i wouldn't have thought that it would make much of a difference, after cooking on them for over 3 years i have to say, i really hate cooking on cheap shit now.

also japanese cooking knives have ruined me for cheap knives.

EvilSteve
15th July 10, 01:05 PM
The molar specific heat of copper may only be about 25% less than that of iron and steel, however the thermal conductivity is roughly 10-20x greater which means a more even heat on the pan (nonstick has MAJOR issues with hot spots) and that it will heat or cool much more quickly than stainless.

http://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/thermal-conductivity-metals-d_858.html

Kein Haar
15th July 10, 02:06 PM
Goon,

It's not a thin pan.

You're a food n00b. Surprising, actually. You clearly know how to feed yourself.

SFGOON
15th July 10, 03:52 PM
I'm a gourmand, you kraut asshole.

Your assertion that the pan, AND I QUOTE!!!


#1. Compared to stainless, you don't need nearly as much heat blasting underneath, since it conducts so well.

#2. You don't have to wait nearly as long for it TO heat up.

#3. You can put the flame on the one end, and the heat conducts equally well on the opposite side many inches away....as tested with drops of water.

Does not stand up to the zeroth, first and second laws of thermodynamics. Simply put, nothing in the universe will heat quickly and evenly using an uneven heating source.

This is because any given substance will dissipate heat at the same rate it absorbs it, a physical property called "specific heat."

Anything that heats up quickly will also dissipate that heat into the air quickly. This will result in a "heat gradient" across the surface of the pan.

Now - if I were a scheister and a scam artist, here's what I would do. I would over-engineer a god-damn pan, and make sure I used attractive brushed copper and stainless steel riveted to a "vintage" handle. This would cause it to look good.

Further, I would "demonstrate" it to prospective buyers by heating one end of the pan to - I dunno - 130 degrees Celsius, knowing full well that would be enough joules of energy to raise the portion of the pan opposite the heat source to 100 degrees.

Mind you, that's a significant difference.

For VERY sure, I would do this with a gas stove. Much more quick heatings all around.

But here's the kicker. Even though it would be cheap and easy, I wouldn't be so dumb as to let them use an infra-red thermometer to "scan" it and see a consistently even number at a tight tolerance. Oh no - that would expose the scam!

What I'd do, see, is add water droplets to the surface of the pan, knowing every temperature across the gradient will boil it away quickly without revealing the gradient. I then tell people it means the pan "heats evenly."

They then give me a lot of money. Copper and stainless are about the same per pound - around three dollars. How much does that thing weigh? Seven pounds shipping weight, estimate one pound of packing, so that's 18$ worth of raw materials....

I don't know what kind of mass manufacturing covers the difference between 18$ and $309, but.... whoah!

That being said, it is an attractive piece of cookware, and I would be proud to own a set.

You should probably check with me first before you decide anything is impressive.

I am here to help.

Kein Haar
15th July 10, 04:23 PM
I'll copy and paste that for my mom immediately!

"This chubby kid from them internets told me to tell you this. I'm not sure, but I know he's some sort of student who got booted from army and cop stuff. No, I don't think he's a professional PER SE, but he's got pretty sweet plans. Well...this one plan involving a steroid, but the only thing stopping him is the sophisticated hardware and reagents. No, I don't think the latter requirements and inaccessibility thereto is just an excuse for it's current non-existence. Well, agree to disagree then. Right, that's what you always told me growing up...'don't be a goddamn n00b your whole life and follow through with stuff.' Yeah, I dunno either. He seems credible, though. Ok, I'll tell him."

Mom says stop being such a goddamn n00b and follow through with something for once.

She says she's keeping the pan and she loves me.

SFGOON
15th July 10, 05:08 PM
Do remind your "mom," (I doubt you have one, as you strike me as rather unlovable,) that I've been involved in the chemical industry since I was commissioned into the U.S. Chemical Corps six years ago. And also that I underwent sixty credit-hours of graduate-level chemistry training as a result of that commission. And also tell her I've worked some civilian jobs in the chemical industry too.

Also tell her that I've successfully completed independent research projects which resulted in a field-applicable remedy for nociception induced by topical application of capsaicin, and have also compounded resiniferatoxin (RTX) into a novel riot control agent which is not treatable in the same manner as capsiacinoids.

Finally, tell her I'm not chubby, God-dammit! I'm a fucking GOURMAND!!

Leave the swears in when you deliver this message to her, or take them out. I don't care.

Kein Haar
15th July 10, 07:27 PM
Preaching to the choir. I was totally defending you.

SFGOON
15th July 10, 07:34 PM
Did you remind her that I'm a gourmand, too? 'Cuz that's really important.

I don't want anyone thinking I'm fat.

Kein Haar
15th July 10, 07:42 PM
An older usage of the word is to describe a person given to excess in the consumption of food and drink, synonymous with "glutton."

In this latter usage, there is a parallel concern among the French that their word for the appreciation of gourmet cuisine (gourmandise) is historically included in the French Catholic list of the Seven Deadly Sins.

SFGOON
15th July 10, 07:58 PM
Yeah, an OLD USAGE OF THE WORD!!

Nowadays, when you say "girl," do you mean "young male?"

When you say "fuck," do you mean "crash?"

You understand the futility of all this, don't you?

Kein Haar
15th July 10, 09:15 PM
No.

HappyOldGuy
15th July 10, 09:22 PM
Kein if your mommy is happy, then you get the points no matter what.

But I would have a hard time justifying that for myself. I spring for copper bottomed stainless, but I just don't believe that physics works better for the french.

SFGOON
15th July 10, 09:38 PM
I dunno man. He would have gotten exactly the same physics out of a 4$ pan at the local Goodwill. Have at it with some steel wool on a sander and it's all shiny.

Then he could have crazy-glued some seashells or hearts to it, or some shit. Mothers love things you make yourself.

Hell, the water demo would have worked on that, too.

Then Mrs. Haar could have told her ladies sewing circle that the pan hung on the wall was hand-made by little Keiny.

And he'd have been up - let's see - 305$.

Dark Helmet
15th July 10, 10:01 PM
Does not stand up to the zeroth, first and second laws of thermodynamics. Simply put, nothing in the universe will heat quickly and evenly using an uneven heating source.

This is because any given substance will dissipate heat at the same rate it absorbs it, a physical property called "specific heat."

Anything that heats up quickly will also dissipate that heat into the air quickly. This will result in a "heat gradient" across the surface of the pan.

Now - if I were a scheister and a scam artist, here's what I would do. I would over-engineer a god-damn pan, and make sure I used attractive brushed copper and stainless steel riveted to a "vintage" handle. This would cause it to look good.

Further, I would "demonstrate" it to prospective buyers by heating one end of the pan to - I dunno - 130 degrees Celsius, knowing full well that would be enough joules of energy to raise the portion of the pan opposite the heat source to 100 degrees.

Mind you, that's a significant difference.

For VERY sure, I would do this with a gas stove. Much more quick heatings all around.

But here's the kicker. Even though it would be cheap and easy, I wouldn't be so dumb as to let them use an infra-red thermometer to "scan" it and see a consistently even number at a tight tolerance. Oh no - that would expose the scam!

What I'd do, see, is add water droplets to the surface of the pan, knowing every temperature across the gradient will boil it away quickly without revealing the gradient. I then tell people it means the pan "heats evenly."

They then give me a lot of money. Copper and stainless are about the same per pound - around three dollars. How much does that thing weigh? Seven pounds shipping weight, estimate one pound of packing, so that's 18$ worth of raw materials....

I don't know what kind of mass manufacturing covers the difference between 18$ and $309, but.... whoah!

That being said, it is an attractive piece of cookware, and I would be proud to own a set.

You should probably check with me first before you decide anything is impressive.

I am here to help.Sweet Jesus! You seem to have too much time on your hands!

SoulMechanic
15th July 10, 10:19 PM
^^^ He also just admitted to reading 130 pages of Dagon bashing. Goon how about going for a jog or fucking your wife. Mix it up a lil bit brah.

SFGOON
15th July 10, 10:33 PM
^^^ He also just admitted to reading 130 pages of Dagon bashing. Goon how about going for a jog or fucking your wife. Mix it up a lil bit brah.

Well, this is kind of a funny story. Maybe.

So I took a two-week lay off from my ADD meds to rebuild my tolerance, as is advisable and responsible. r.

Took my first dose after the layoff this morning, except my doctor didn't think to lower it.

So, for the next few days, expect feats of concentration. It's not that I have too much time on my hands, it's that my brain won't let me relax - I have to do productive things right now.

GOD DAMN I love this shit!!

SoulMechanic
15th July 10, 11:04 PM
Well, this is kind of a funny story. Maybe.

So I took a two-week lay off from my ADD meds to rebuild my tolerance, as is advisable and responsible. r.

Took my first dose after the layoff this morning, except my doctor didn't think to lower it.

So, for the next few days, expect feats of concentration. It's not that I have too much time on my hands, it's that my brain won't let me relax - I have to do productive things right now.

GOD DAMN I love this shit!!


Quoted for, HIGH ON DRUGS!

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
16th July 10, 01:29 AM
Well, this is kind of a funny story. Maybe.

So I took a two-week lay off from my ADD meds to rebuild my tolerance, as is advisable and responsible. r.

Took my first dose after the layoff this morning, except my doctor didn't think to lower it.

So, for the next few days, expect feats of concentration. It's not that I have too much time on my hands, it's that my brain won't let me relax - I have to do productive things right now.

GOD DAMN I love this shit!!

tell me why i shouldn't buy $300 sneakers
i mean
they're made in italy n shit

Ragout
16th July 10, 01:52 AM
Copper bottomed pans are a bitch to clean.. well you really need to polish them after each use. Most professional style pans now have a layer of copper somewhere sandwiched between the bottom and the surface since copper is a great heat conductor.

SoulMechanic
16th July 10, 02:12 AM
^^^ One day you will make a man very happy.

SFGOON
16th July 10, 02:16 AM
tell me why i shouldn't buy $300 sneakers
i mean
they're made in italy n shit

All the best shit comes from Italy! You should totally get those.


Just don't expect them to evenly conduct heat, even if some scheister in a cotton suit drips some water on it and it boils away.

Ajamil
16th July 10, 03:45 AM
She had them copper bottomed pans,
Gas-cooking stove,
The cook thought she was in love.

She used some cloves!
Next thing you know,
Burner's on low low low low...

EvilSteve
16th July 10, 08:27 AM
Regarding temperature gradients-

http://www.cookingissues.com/2010/02/16/heavy-metal-the-science-of-cast-iron-cooking/

This is really about cast iron, but pertains to this discussion. And it's got pictures for anyone who doesn't want to read.

tl;dr: temperature gradients are a real thing and cooking with better conductors such as copper or aluminum reduces them. The reason to use copper as a conductor rather than aluminum is it has a higher thermal conductivity (about 1.9 of Al) and lower specific heat (about 0.4 of Al) and therefore will heat more evenly as well as heat and cool faster, making the pan temp more responsive to changes in burner level.

WRT Personal experience, I've used nonstick, stainless, cast iron and copper. While it would be silly to say copper is "best" (since different materials are suited to different tasks) I will say that it is the most responsive to temperature and heats the most evenly- you're not likely to get something that is burned on one side and underdone on the other with a copper pan. I have had that problem with stainless and nonstick.

SFGOON
16th July 10, 09:15 AM
That article is something of an oversimplification.

Honestly, if you wanted to eliminate the gradient altogether, you'd use a metal called "gallium" which is solid at room temperature but melts at something like 24 degrees. (So yes, you pick it up and it will melt in your hand.)

Putting a pool of gallium in the center of the pan would create a convection current and distribute the heat perfectly evenly.

The engineering and metalworking involved in something like that might actually be worth $309.

EvilSteve
16th July 10, 09:30 AM
Yes, and I'm not going to say copper cookware isn't overpriced. Additionally, you need to make sure you buy quality stuff and not just expensive stuff, since there is a lot of poorly made copper cookware out that. But in my experience, the good stuff really does do what it says. The major drawback as someone said is that it's a bitch to clean and polish.


However, the gallium cored pan sounds like a cool idea. Question is- would the reduced temperature gradient be noticeable compared to copper?

SFGOON
16th July 10, 10:15 AM
Absolutely. Metals transmit heat from atom to atom which is a slow and uneven process. They are just as likely to evolve heat into the surrounding environment as they are to pass it to a neighboring metal atom - hence the temperature gradient.

Liquid gallium would be different in that it would change density as it heated, which would provoke a physical migration in response to the gradient carrying the heat energy elsewhere. This would create a more homogeneous heating surface.

Better even than copper would be to make the pan out of a tungsten/iron alloy. The difference in specific heat between copper and iron isn't all that special. (Copper and Iron are .39 and .46, respectively. Tungsten is a .13)

EvilSteve
16th July 10, 10:44 AM
I think we're ready to file for a patent. I propose Ultimet for the body alloy. Although it's primarily cobalt, it has a specific heat equivalent to pure tungsten, thermal conductivity roughly half that of pure copper, is incredibly durable, highly non-reactive and resistant to corrosion.

We'd probably have to charge about a grand per pan, but I'm thinking high-end niche markets here.

littleoldme
16th July 10, 10:51 AM
I think your mum is very lucky and should be well happy with that awesome piece of kit.

The only problem with copper pans is that eventually the silverly coating wears away and you are left with copper shining through, which looks very pretty but can apparently put you at risk of being poisoned by verdigris.

It may be just a theoretical risk, as something probably has to happen for the verdigris to form.

Anyway, a beautiful, expensive item with a small risk of poisoning, but only eventually. What could be nicer?

SFGOON
16th July 10, 10:59 AM
I think we're ready to file for a patent. I propose Ultimet for the body alloy. Although it's primarily cobalt, it has a specific heat equivalent to pure tungsten, thermal conductivity roughly half that of pure copper, is incredibly durable, highly non-reactive and resistant to corrosion.

We'd probably have to charge about a grand per pan, but I'm thinking high-end niche markets here.

If you're going to charge a grand per pan, we might as well charge $3,400.


Reason being anyone with that kind of cash to blow on a pan has funding which is pretty much unlimited on a mortal's scale, ergo doesn't really give a shit whether something costs $3,400 or $1,000, and pricing it that high will only serve to convince them of the quality. Consider it as feature of the item making it more attractive to our target demographic.

EvilSteve
16th July 10, 12:40 PM
I like your thinking. Also, given that Ultimet is about $850/lb and is incredibly difficult to machine due to its hardness it would probably cost on the order of $2K per unit to produce. Or we could go with your original plan and go with an iron-tungsten alloy which would probably have similar enough thermal / reactive properties but much cost less to produce- and still charge $3400 for a pan.

For the ads I'm thinking we do as you suggested and do a thermal scan of your basic expensive-but-poorly-made copper cookware alongside a thermal scan of ours. Then below have some ad copy about how you're a shitty mother / have a small penis if you use the genetically inferior cookware. Target it at the type of schmucks you see on The Real Housewives of ______ - you know, the type of people who will probably never cook a meal for themselves in their lives but will happily spend several hundred grand to remodel their kitchen.

SFGOON
16th July 10, 04:29 PM
You're pretty good at this. All that we need to do now is set up distribution and manufacturing.

I insist it be made in the USA. And by made in the USA I mean the handle. We can then set up manufacturing of the gallium pan in India (best metallurgy,) then have the pans attached to the handles in a sweatshop near Tijuana, (no need to pay US workers for that!) and yeah - we can write "hand crafted in the USA" on the panhandle.

Rich housewives will think the whole fucking thing was made in the USA.

Kiko
16th July 10, 07:26 PM
Can you still hit someone in the head with these newfangled pans of yours?

WarPhalange
16th July 10, 10:25 PM
Can you still hit someone in the head with these newfangled pans of yours?

Yes, and the pain will spread faster and more evenly.

SFGOON
16th July 10, 10:32 PM
No. That is not the pan's intended purpose and will void the warranty.

Sorry, but I have to limit my liability.

Kein Haar
16th July 10, 10:51 PM
You guyz don't know jack squat about the finer points of cooking and what makes it effortless and glorious. This pan does that.

You probably eat flour out of the palms of your hands. Your too fat and uncouth for your individual digits to even work in tandem.

Kiko
17th July 10, 04:46 AM
No. That is not the pan's intended purpose and will void the warranty.

Sorry, but I have to limit my liability.

Fine, then make me a titanium rolling pin!

Robot Jesus
17th July 10, 02:39 PM
just give me cast iron.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
17th July 10, 02:40 PM
I'll give you 12 inches of ym dick and you'll like it bitch

Kein Haar
17th July 10, 03:17 PM
Don't kid.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
17th July 10, 03:18 PM
my dick is huge
what the fuck do you know

Ajamil
17th July 10, 04:00 PM
You post pics in shorts.

Kiko
17th July 10, 04:01 PM
Fry an egg on it or take it to another thread!

Robot Jesus
17th July 10, 05:00 PM
the only thing I will cook an egg in is not stick, and that's the only thing I use it for.

the density of the iron means that the temperature is easier to control, even if it takes a while to warm up. also if you balance an iron pan on a possessed persons head it binds the daemon and allows you to preform the exorcism at your leisure.

EvilSteve
17th July 10, 05:50 PM
You're pretty good at this. All that we need to do now is set up distribution and manufacturing.

I insist it be made in the USA. And by made in the USA I mean the handle. We can then set up manufacturing of the gallium pan in India (best metallurgy,) then have the pans attached to the handles in a sweatshop near Tijuana, (no need to pay US workers for that!) and yeah - we can write "hand crafted in the USA" on the panhandle.

Rich housewives will think the whole fucking thing was made in the USA.

Wasn't going to check Sociocide today, but since I'm drunk....


I fully agree. I was going to insist it be made in USA, and by USA I mean Usa, Japan. However, I think we'll get better labor costs with your manufacturing plan.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
17th July 10, 06:33 PM
You post pics in shorts.

So?

Ajamil
17th July 10, 08:47 PM
Sorry, MJS, I would explain but Kiko has spoken.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
17th July 10, 11:10 PM
PM it to me in the form of an erotic story.