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Japuma
6th May 10, 12:02 PM
http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/local-beat/Students-Wearing-American-Flag-Shirts-Sent-Home-92945969.html

What the f*ck??? Since when is Cinco De Mayo a national holiday with a dress code? Hell, it's barely a holiday in Mexico.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 12:09 PM
I think the principal was wrong, but be real, why do you think they were wearing them that day?

Spade: The Real Snake
6th May 10, 12:28 PM
"I had relatives that rode with Pancho Villa"*







*every vato I have ever spoken to.

DerAuslander108
6th May 10, 12:43 PM
I think the principal was wrong, but be real, why do you think they were wearing them that day?

Who gives a shit? It's irrelevant.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 01:30 PM
Who gives a shit? It's irrelevant.

It's irrelevant if a group of white students were trying to stir up shit with a group of chicano students?

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 01:45 PM
""I think they should apologize cause it is a Mexican Heritage Day," Annicia Nunez, a Live Oak High student, said. "We don't deserve to be get disrespected like that. We wouldn't do that on Fourth of July"


"But to many Mexican-American students at Live Oak, this was a big deal. They say they were offended by the five boys and others for wearing American colors on a Mexican holiday."




It was "a Mexican Heritage Day". What the hell were American students i.e., US citizens doing in a California school on a Mexican holiday?

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 02:04 PM
Nowadays, Cinco de Mayo is a Mexican american holiday, not a mexican one. Just like St Patricks day is an Irish american holiday, not an Irish one.

Spade: The Real Snake
6th May 10, 02:04 PM
""I think they should apologize cause it is a Mexican Heritage Day," Annicia Nunez, a Live Oak High student, said. "We don't deserve to be get disrespected like that. We wouldn't do that on Fourth of July
Cuz no skool on teh forf uv Jooly." said Chuy.

Actually, this isn't true. I doubt all the vatos remove the Mexican Flag from their cars and homes on AMERICAN Independence Day.



"But to many Mexican-American students at Live Oak, this was a big deal. They say they were offended by the five boys and others for wearing American colors on a Mexican holiday."
lulwut?

Cinco de Mayo is a regional holiday limited primarily to the state of Puebla. There is some limited recognition of the holiday in other parts of the country.


It was "a Mexican Heritage Day". What the hell were American students i.e., US citizens doing in a California school on a Mexican holiday?
I guess all the bitches better be dressin' up as fucking OLG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Our_Lady_of_Guadalupe)then.

DerAuslander108
6th May 10, 02:10 PM
It's irrelevant if a group of white students were trying to stir up shit with a group of chicano students?

If by "stirring up shit" you mean, wearing the flag of the nation that those white and chicano students reside in, then yes, it is absolutely completely irrelevant whether they wore those shirts on Cinco de Mayo, Saint Paddy's Day, or Christmas.

Had they worn those shirts while carrying posters that said "Go home wetbacks!" you'd have a point.

"Stirring up shit" takes two. Anyone who's posted here or on Bullshido should know that.

Demanding an apology is even more ludicrous.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 02:12 PM
If by "stirring up shit" you mean, wearing the flag of the nation that those white and chicano students reside in, then yes, it is absolutely completely irrelevant whether they wore those shirts on Cinco de Mayo, Saint Paddy's Day, or Christmas.

Had they worn those shirts while carrying posters that said "Go home wetbacks!" you'd have a point.

"Stirring up shit" takes two. Anyone who's posted here or on Bullshido should know that.

Demanding an apology is even more ludicrous.
I said I didn't support the principal. But if you think those kids decided to wear those clothes on that day just because they liked the colors, you're sniffing glue.

It would be like wearing orange to a St Patricks day parade in boston. Should you be alllowed to, of course. Might you do it innocently, sure. Are you probably doing it to be a douche, well, yeah.

Japuma
6th May 10, 02:14 PM
Atleast one of the student was of Mexican decent.

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 02:18 PM
Nowadays, Cinco de Mayo is a Mexican american holiday, not a mexican one. Just like St Patricks day is an Irish american holiday, not an Irish one.



Cinco de Mayo is a "holiday" imported by large corporations intent on selling more beer in the US market.

I bought a case of Modelo especial and am having one now. Mmmm tasty.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 02:19 PM
Cinco de Mayo is a "holiday" imported by large corporations intent on selling more beer in the US market.

I bought a case of Modelo especial and am having one now. Mmmm tasty.
Exactly, just like St Patricks. Except Guiness is better beer.

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 02:26 PM
imo, one of the bigger aspects of this is that many first, second, or even third generation Mexican "immigrants" see themselves as Mexicans living in the US.


Mexicans first, US citizens second. btw, this is phenomenon is manifest in Central and South America also. Except the immigrants were from Europe.

Steve
6th May 10, 02:30 PM
Fuck the t shirts, they have a brunch break? What the fuck is that shit??

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 02:30 PM
My experience of second and later is really different than that. IME there is a very strong identification as mexican americans as something distinct from both 'wetbacks' and 'gringo's'.

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 02:37 PM
My experience of second and later is really different than that. IME there is a very strong identification as mexican americans as something distinct from both 'wetbacks' and 'gringo's'.


I would not disagree with your experience. Will you share?

DerAuslander108
6th May 10, 03:11 PM
But if you think those kids decided to wear those clothes on that day just because they liked the colors, you're sniffing glue.

Did I say that?

Fuck no.


It would be like wearing orange to a St Patricks day parade in boston. Should you be alllowed to, of course. Might you do it innocently, sure. Are you probably doing it to be a douche, well, yeah.

Which...again...IS FUCKING IRRELEVANT.

Were the kids trying to make a statement and knew exactly what they were doing?

Likely.

However, they are not the issue in this problem at all.

And it is nothing like wearing Orange on St Paddy's Day.

Absofuckinglutely nothing.

It's like wearing the American flag on St. Paddy's Day.

Your comparison is meritless.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 03:17 PM
It's like wearing the American flag on St. Paddy's Day.

Your comparison is meritless.

So you're saying that an american flag is a neutral statement less than a week after douchebitch in Arizona signed her little piece of moronity?

DerAuslander108
6th May 10, 03:52 PM
So you're saying that an american flag is a neutral statement less than a week after douchebitch in Arizona signed her little piece of moronity?

Are you fucking kidding me?

Read what I said.

Did anything I said have a thing to do with Arizona immigration policy?

Did I say anything about neutral statements, positive statements, or negative statements?

The "reasons" for the group of students choosing to wear the American flag are irrelevant in the face of the reactions of those who have a problem with it.

Spade: The Real Snake
6th May 10, 03:57 PM
So you're saying that an american flag is a neutral statement less than a week after douchebitch in Arizona signed her little piece of moronity?

HTFU Bitchez
they should have worn this (http://media.rei.com/media/436854.jpg)

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 04:05 PM
Okay, you are bouncing all over the place, and I don't think either of us has any idea what point you are trying to make. The only point I made was that the students were probably trying to be racist douchebags. I am in favor of people being allowed to be douchebags in public, and also in favor of calling them on it.

So if you disagree with me, then either you don't think that there is any chance the students were trying to be douchebags, or you don't think that racists are douchebags.

Ajamil
6th May 10, 04:08 PM
So to sum up the argument -

Der: The shortest distance between two points is a straight line.
HOG: No, a straight line is the shortest distance between two points.

Spade: The Real Snake
6th May 10, 04:20 PM
I guess we better not wear the Stars and Stripes on Dia De Los Muertos (http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=20000505&slug=4019212) cuz bitchez get sad.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 04:28 PM
Actually we would prefer if you seceded from the union.

Then we can all wear whatever we like.

If you take Texas with you, I'll buy you a pony.

MEGA JESUS-SAMA
6th May 10, 04:29 PM
That is seriously some weak ass posturing. What was the point if you're just going to say "nuh uh we just like American flags!" when someone called you out on it?

Ajamil
6th May 10, 04:38 PM
At least the counter marchers that I saw on the "Day of No Work" were burning Mexican flags. No ambiguity there.

Spade: The Real Snake
6th May 10, 04:55 PM
Actually we would prefer if you seceded from the union.
No, we will drag you prune-pickers kicking and screaming


Then we can all wear whatever we like.

you already do wear assless chaps.


If you take Texas with you, I'll buy you a pony.
make it a sheep and Texas will follow willingly

Kiko
6th May 10, 05:11 PM
http://icanhascheezburger.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/128751301791624576.jpg

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 05:40 PM
So to sum up the argument -

Der: The shortest distance between two points is a straight line.
HOG: No, a straight line is the shortest distance between two points.


^+rep.


The students were making a political statement. Labeling them as racist redirects discussion away from the politics of illegal immigration and the political and cultural transformations effected by such.

HoG, you were going to share your life experiences with latinos in California?

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 05:46 PM
HoG, you were going to share your life experiences with latinos in California?

There is nothing really to share. It's just an impression that I've picked up over the years. I've certainly heard the phrase 'wetback' more from second plus generation chicano's than I ever have from white folks, and it's not that I don't know racist white folks.

Frank White
6th May 10, 06:13 PM
There is nothing really to share. It's just an impression that I've picked up over the years. I've certainly heard the phrase 'wetback' more from second plus generation chicano's than I ever have from white folks, and it's not that I don't know racist white folks.

it's not really considered a derogatory term by chicanos. They also refer to themselves as beaners.

My wife is a beaner. She hates Cinco de Mayo. "If you like Mexico so much go back, fuckin' wetback!" She gets mad when people think I'm Mexican because she'd "never date a Mexican."

Here in Modesto California, you have lowriders cruising with Mexico flags, a few raised trucks with American flags, and inevitably, fights. It's expected. Just remember kids, you don't fight just one bean, you gotta fight the whole burrito.

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 08:02 PM
There is nothing really to share. It's just an impression that I've picked up over the years. I've certainly heard the phrase 'wetback' more from second plus generation chicano's than I ever have from white folks, and it's not that I don't know racist white folks.


Okay. Just trying to understand the depth /breadth of your experience. Are you saying you have lived for a number of years (or months) near and have interacted with a Mexican immigrant population? Asking based on the below:



My experience of second and later is really different than that. IME there is a very strong identification as mexican americans as something distinct from both 'wetbacks' and 'gringo's'.

Phrost
6th May 10, 08:20 PM
Has someone mentioned how Mexicans in their own country don't give a shit about Cinco de Mayo? They don't even get it off for work.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 08:26 PM
Okay. Just trying to understand the depth /breadth of your experience. Are you saying you have lived for a number of years (or months) near and have interacted with a Mexican immigrant population? Asking based on the below:

Sure. Grew up in a town that was about 50/50. Lived in the inner mission in SF for 10 years, etc. I'm not claiming any kind of expertise, I was just relating my experience.

BadUglyMagic
6th May 10, 08:54 PM
Sure. Grew up in a town that was about 50/50. Lived in the inner mission in SF for 10 years, etc. I'm not claiming any kind of expertise, I was just relating my experience.


Thanks.

Zendetta
6th May 10, 09:29 PM
I think the principal was wrong, but be real, why do you think they were wearing them that day?

I fucking knew you would be the one making this point. Fucking knew it.

Heads up: American citizens have the Right to Free Speech.

American Citizens DO NOT have the Right to Never be Offended (not yet anyway), no matter how much their ethnic minority may have been oppressed.

The kids were dressed head-to-toe in American flags, right down to their shoes - of course they were being douchebags. But as you damn well know, polite, well-mannered, uncontroversial speech and expression doesn't need the 1st amendment to protect it.

You are also neatly avoiding the subtext. The principal sent them home to avoid fights. In other words, he knew that he would not be able to control the minority youth from using violence to suppress an unpopular opinion. After all, Latinos are the demographic most likely to commit a Hate Crime in California - as you've said yourself. Reconquista what?

So, yeah, the kids were being douchebags... but if you've got an ounce of testicle in your sack you should be fighting tooth and nail for their rights to do so, because this is a fucking outrage.

jkdbuck76
6th May 10, 09:34 PM
Has someone mentioned how Mexicans in their own country don't give a shit about Cinco de Mayo? They don't even get it off for work.

That's right. So why is it such a BFD here? I mean, I'm the 7th generation of my family in America. My people came from Wales.

But you don't see me jerking off to a Welsh flag on St. David's Day.

HappyOldGuy
6th May 10, 10:53 PM
I fucking knew you would be the one making this point. Fucking knew it.

Heads up: American citizens have the Right to Free Speech.

Comment 1 learn to fucking read.


I think the principal was wrong

I said I didn't support the principal

I am in favor of people being allowed to be douchebags in public


You are also neatly avoiding the subtext. The principal sent them home to avoid fights. In other words, he knew that he would not be able to control the minority youth from using violence to suppress an unpopular opinion. After all, Latinos are the demographic most likely to commit a Hate Crime in California - as you've said yourself. Reconquista what?

Comment 2, you can shove that load of bigotted bullshit up your ass sideways without lube. You know as well as I do that that's because hate crime laws are being misused for black versus hispanic gang shit down in LA.

nihilist
6th May 10, 11:10 PM
Next time I have to stab somebody I'm going to make sure that as I do it I yell: "I'm doing this because I love you."

Spade: The Real Snake
7th May 10, 09:59 AM
That's right. So why is it such a BFD here?

Jose Cuervo, Tostidos, Corona, Dos XX, Rosarita, Pace, Old El Paso (http://www.sociocide.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1544110&postcount=24)


Has someone mentioned how Mexicans in their own country don't give a shit about Cinco de Mayo? They don't even get it off for work.

Si' Mon (http://www.sociocide.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1544060&postcount=8)

Ajamil
7th May 10, 11:04 AM
You mean every country isn't like Amurrika and they don't all have a single day where the birth of the nation is celebrated? What nonsense. Next you'll tell me that the non-Christmas holidays in December aren't the most important of the year for their respective religions.

jvjim
7th May 10, 11:20 AM
Labeling what those boys did as racism is assinine.

jkdbuck76
7th May 10, 11:32 AM
Flip the situation around. Say it was Flag Day (or 4th of July) and some Latinos were wearing their Mexican flags. The Vice Principal tells them that they have to take of their bandanna and flip their shirts inside out.

Massive shit-storm in the media? A story about an evil administrator who is trying to kill the 1st Amendment rights of some poor immigrants' kids?

Spade: The Real Snake
7th May 10, 11:44 AM
Flip the situation around. Say it was Flag Day (or 4th of July) and some Latinos were wearing their Mexican flags. The Vice Principal tells them that they have to take of their bandanna and flip their shirts inside out.

Massive shit-storm in the media? A story about an evil administrator who is trying to kill the 1st Amendment rights of some poor immigrants' kids?

Fuck that shit.
Vatos better be dressin' like Indians come Thanksgiving cuz bronze-skinned.

Spade: The Real Snake
7th May 10, 11:46 AM
AHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHA (http://i39.tinypic.com/3588484.jpg)

KhorneliusPraxx
7th May 10, 12:33 PM
ahhh, more liberal education force multiculturalism anti-american bullshit...did any of you expect anything less.

Why anyone would get in this much shit over some bullshit the Corona™ made up to sell more beer is beyond me.

Adouglasmhor
7th May 10, 02:49 PM
You mean every country isn't like Amurrika and they don't all have a single day where the birth of the nation is celebrated? What nonsense. Next you'll tell me that the non-Christmas holidays in December aren't the most important of the year for their respective religions.
Christmas isn't even the most important festival in Xtianity, Easter is.

Zendetta
7th May 10, 06:56 PM
Next time I have to stab somebody I'm going to make sure that as I do it I yell: "I'm doing this because I love you."

Uh, aren't you wanted for enough "Love Crimes" already?

Zendetta
7th May 10, 07:43 PM
Comment 1 learn to fucking read.

My reading is better than your memory. This is what you posted:


I think the principal was wrong, but be real, why do you think they were wearing them that day?


It's irrelevant if a group of white students were trying to stir up shit with a group of chicano students?


Nowadays, Cinco de Mayo is a Mexican american holiday, not a mexican one. Just like St Patricks day is an Irish american holiday, not an Irish one.

Yeah, just like that. This is like someone wearing a Union Jack shirt on St Patrick's Day... only they are doing it in England.


Comment 2, you can shove that load of bigotted bullshit up your ass sideways without lube. You know as well as I do that that's because hate crime laws are being misused for black versus hispanic gang shit down in LA.

That "Bigoted Bullshit" ad hominem may work on your wussy PC friends, but it sure as hell doesn't work on me.

Is it "Bigoted", let alone "bullshit" to note that Latinos have a higher than average rate of violence? No, its a fucking fact.

Is it bigoted, let alone bullshit, to note that there is a widespread pattern of latino violence targeting black people, especially in socal? Again, no its fucking not. You may not have the stones to call it "ethnic cleansing", but that's the way it looks to the victims.

Is it bigoted, let alone bullshit, to reflect on the term reconquista de la raza?No, it's their term, not mine.

Is it bigoted, let alone bullshit, to note that the kids were told to take it off to avoid violence? No, that's plainly what happened.

Who do you think would have instigated that violence, the 5 kids wearing stars and stripes, or the 200 kids who walked out of class and called for the boys' suspension?

Actually, you probably do believe it would be the five kids wearing the flag. White liberal guilt makes it impossible for you to condemn the bad behavior of anyone, unless they are white. As usual.


The only point I made was that the students were probably trying to be racist douchebags. I am in favor of people being allowed to be douchebags in public, and also in favor of calling them on it.

At least one of the "racist douchebags" is in fact part mexican himself. At least three of the five have latin names.

So the only point you were making was, in fact, itself a bigoted assumption.

LOL, ok. I think you can shut the fuck up now.

If you were really in favor of calling out douchebaggery, you'd have something to say about the Hispanic students and the Principal, something a little stronger than


<limp-dicked defense of free speech>, but really, the problem is uppity white nativists.

HappyOldGuy
7th May 10, 07:45 PM
If you were really in favor of calling out douchebaggery, you'd have something to say about the Hispanic students and the Principal, something a little stronger than

I have stood up for peoples free speech more often and harder than you ever would dream of in your limp dicked gen Y more ironic than thou world.

Zendetta
7th May 10, 07:49 PM
I have stood up for peoples free speech more often and harder than you ever would dream

Actually, I believe this part. Its related to why I get so bent out of shape when you pussy-out like this.


of in your limp dicked gen Y more ironic than thou world.

But this part is a bushel basket of migrant-worker picked FAIL.

Adouglasmhor
8th May 10, 01:00 AM
[QUOTE=Zendetta]


Yeah, just like that. This is like someone wearing a Union Jack shirt on St Patrick's Day... only they are doing it in England.


St Patrick's cross is part of the Union flag (It's not on a fucking boat so it's not a Jack) so why would anyone be offended? It's the red saltire (X) on white. Plus St Patrick was British not Irish.

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-8/1070113/350px-Flags_of_the_Union_Jack.svg.jpg

Spade: The Real Snake
8th May 10, 10:19 AM
So NOB is safe wearing his stars and bars on St. Paddy's day?