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Zendetta
3rd August 07, 06:02 PM
... and I'm thinking the Black Muslims* did it.


*if anyone doesn't know, I'm not talking about black people who happend to practice the religion of islam, but rather these guys: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_muslim


So, I was training some standup and jogging with my friend Cliff on tuesday, and he told me that a *prominent black journalist was brutally assassinated in broad daylight the other day out here in Oakland. Apparently masked men opened up on him with an AK, within sight of city hall. Crazee.

(* re. 'prominent' - in all fairness, I'd never heard of him. Not that it matters)

Anyways, today an article shows up: apparently OPD busted almost 20 folks and raided several places including the Black Muslim Bakerey, which serves up fresh baked goods with a side order of afrocentrism.

THe Black Muslims have been a force in Oakland for quite a while, but as community supporters their stock has fallen due to a pattern of corruption, violence, and intimidation. Plus, their leader Yusef Bey was put up on charges of raping underage girls - a charge which he beat by dying. More recently his son was arrested for violently intimidating shopkeepers for selling booze in poor black neighborhoods.

More generally, I understand that Black Muslims have some strong race-and-gender issues that would make the local PC crowd freek out if white people did it: namely, women are second class citizens who cannot interact with males, and big prohibitions against interracial dating and relationships.

Anecdotally, I've met some who were frankly quite cool to me but had huge chips on thier shoulders generally.

They still have some considerable clout in the ghetto though, not to mention real estate holdings.

Well apparently this Bailey cat was investigating them - my friend told me he had heard it was a corruption investigation. He got blown away and they got raided.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20108044/?GT1=10252

I'll post more when I find out. In general, it confirms my theory that revolutionary groups are usually very susceptible to mutating into dangerous criminal outfits more involved with organized crime than organizing social change.

It also confirms my general thinking that people who gravitate towards racially charged identity movements tend to be morally lacking.

ICY
3rd August 07, 06:17 PM
http://www.die-ritze.com/poster/original/black_gestapo.jpg
And here, I thought it was just a ridiculous movie...

bob
3rd August 07, 06:18 PM
Is it a crime for black people to kill each other in America?

WarPhalange
3rd August 07, 06:23 PM
Of course. Just like smoking pot is a crime.

Zendetta
3rd August 07, 06:28 PM
http://www.die-ritze.com/poster/original/black_gestapo.jpg
And here, I thought it was just a ridiculous movie...

LOL!!!! THey screened that out here recently! I was super disappointed to not have the chance to get stoned as hell and go see that.

jubei33
3rd August 07, 07:23 PM
gangs are gangs...this is just like every revolutionary group or communist country puts democratic in their title. Despite some of the good they did, even the black panthers put on the petty thuggery pants.

Zendetta
3rd August 07, 07:49 PM
That they did. The latter history of the Panthers, including drug dealing and murder of a single mother, are pretty fucking sordid.

Truculent Sheep
3rd August 07, 07:56 PM
I'll post more when I find out. In general, it confirms my theory that revolutionary groups are usually very susceptible to mutating into dangerous criminal outfits more involved with organized crime than organizing social change.

It also confirms my general thinking that people who gravitate towards racially charged identity movements tend to be morally lacking.

Indeed. Look at Northern Ireland: both loyalist and republican terror groups funded themselves with drug dealing and organised crime, to the extent that they followed in the footsteps of the Triads and became full-on crime syndicates. Net Result: Sinn Fein was the first political party with seats in the House of Commons to be funded by bank robberies and smack!

Zendetta
3rd August 07, 08:09 PM
IRA was on my mind.

The logic is pretty obvious: you are fighting the system and you need ways to generate munny, but the economy is dominated by the establishment - which is probably most of why you are a revolutionary anyway.

Of course, the "Establishment" has its own share of connections to drugs, mafia, and other shenanigans (CIA, WHAT?!??!) And in many places, the privileged aristocratic class descends from an original gang of pirates and conquerors anyway.

ICY
3rd August 07, 08:16 PM
Big drug dealers play a significant role in politics, puting people in office, or taking them out, and ABOVE ALL, keeping drugs illegal to ensure inflated prices can only rise, never drop.

I'm talking about Canada, not a troubled or developing country. Any politician can be forced into resignation easily with threats, a "scandal" can be manufactured to justify the resignation to the public. The police can, in no way, protect ANY politician here, not even the Prime Minister. Nor can they anywhere. Because it isn't that individual they will threaten, it's the people they know and love. Organized criminals might not enjoy the notoriety they once did (at least in Canada), but their influence never, ever wanes.

Zendetta
3rd August 07, 08:21 PM
Let me just take this moment to state the mutha-fucking obvious:

Black Nationalist groups are just as retarded as White Nationalist Groups. Its no accident that some of their screeds read practically identical, just switching which group is the real Chosen Few and which are Satan's Spawn.

AND they both hate the Joos!

ICY
3rd August 07, 08:23 PM
Did you know the Stormfront guys and the NoI were, at one time, in "negotiations" to determine who would get what land, after the "inevitable" race war, LOL?

Zendetta
3rd August 07, 08:29 PM
LOL. Awesome.

I think that the NOI guys should get Idaho and the Nazis should get Atlanta.

Riddeck
3rd August 07, 11:53 PM
Big drug dealers play a significant role in politics, puting people in office, or taking them out, and ABOVE ALL, keeping drugs illegal to ensure inflated prices can only rise, never drop.

Big drug dealers = The Central Intelligence Agency

AAAhmed46
4th August 07, 12:20 AM
So what did he do?

jubei33
4th August 07, 02:00 AM
Let me just take this moment to state the mutha-fucking obvious:

Black Nationalist groups are just as retarded as White Nationalist Groups. Its no accident that some of their screeds read practically identical, just switching which group is the real Chosen Few and which are Satan's Spawn.

AND they both hate the Joos!


Racism is a strange beast, in that its funny the lengths one must go to invent justifications for baseless, ignorant assumptions.

Welsing's stuff and her melanin theories in the 70's and 80's, for instance, pretty looney. As for the whiteys, I still can't figure out how joining a certain religion makes you less white.

emboesso
4th August 07, 08:48 AM
...http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20108044/?GT1=10252


Interesting link. The bow tie/bean pie guys can be very dangerous but dealing drugs is not their thing. When Spike Lee was filming "Do The Right Thing" in Bedford-Stuyvesant, in order to present his idealized version of the neighborhood he hired the Black Muslims to keep away the drug dealers to allow filming. Residents in plagued neighborhoods would call them in to restore some order.

I have mixed feelings about them. Some of their goals are noble but their vigilantism is troubling. They use methods the residents applaud, but which at the same if used by the local police would be slammed as brutal and racist.

Thirty five years ago in Harlem was the infamous "Mosque Shooting". Police responded to a desperate 911 call for a police officer needing assistance at a Mosque in Harlem. They were barred from entering which made the police more cetain there was a cop inside needing help. One of the responding officers was shot and killed.

More police arrived and corraled all the occupants inside. Outside bottles began flying and residents were on the verge of rioting. Local representatives showed up, like Congressman Charles Rangel and Adam Clayton Powell, who gave their personal guarantees that if the police pulled out, the occupants of the mosque would all turn themselves in at the police station for questioning.

The police backed off, and naturally no one ever showed up at the police station. Bad blood remained for years and no one was ever charged for the officer's murder. The story has constantly changed over the years as well, as individuals try to paint their role in it in the best light possible. Here is a recent piece about it.

http://nypdconfidential.com/columns/2007/070416.html



On this, the 35th anniversary weekend of the fatal and unsolved shooting of Police Officer Philip Cardillo inside a Harlem mosque, there remains no definitive answer to the question still haunting the New York City police department: Who gave the order to release the dozen Muslim suspects without identifying or fingerprinting them?

In a telephone interview Saturday, Patrick Murphy, police commissioner at the time, says he was kept in the dark about who gave the order.

“I did not learn until years later that it was Chief of Detectives Al Seedman,” he said.

Murphy said that the burly, cigar-chomping Seedman never informed him or Seedman’s direct superior Michael Codd, then the department’s highest-ranking uniformed officer and later police commissioner.

“I didn’t know. I didn’t realize it was Seedman who did it,” said Murphy, now 87 years old. “I thought it was Ward.”

He referred to Benjamin Ward, who had been at the scene as the Deputy Commissioner of Community Affairs and who 11 years later became the city’s first black police commissioner.

“A decision like that, I should have been informed of it as soon as possible,” Murphy said. “For years, I thought it had been Ward. All the time I had that impression, Al never corrected me.

“Even if he couldn’t reach us at the time, you report accurately the next day what you did and why you did it.”

Murphy said that he had never asked Ward. “I never pressed him. It was a delicate thing. It had racial overtones.

“And,” he added, “I was overwhelmed by the news from Mike Codd that we had an agreement with the mosque that I didn’t know a thing about.”

The agreement Murphy referred to was that the department had designated the mosque a “sensitive location.” This meant police agreed not to enter it with their guns drawn.

Cardillo, who had been responding to an anonymous call of an officer in need of assistance on the second floor of a building on Lenox Avenue and 116th Street, had apparently been unaware he was entering a mosque and a “sensitive location.”

The department has never forgotten his shooting. It is again in the news following police commissioner Ray Kelly’s announcement last year of a reinvestigation to find Cardillo’s killer.

The reinvestigation followed publication of a book, “Circle of Six,” by retired detective Randy Jurgensen. The title refers to the six people Jurgensen believes played roles in releasing the suspects. They include Murphy, Codd and Ward as well as then Mayor John Lindsay and Harlem Congressman Charles Rangel.

Seedman is not among them.

But determining who gave the controversial order may prove as difficult as finding Cardillo’s killer.

The shooting, which began with a phony tip, occurred on April 14, 1972. As two officers charged inside, a fracas broke out between them and the mosque’s Muslims, outraged at the cops’ intrusion. Shots were fired. Cardillo was killed.

While police herded a dozen suspects into the mosque’s basement for questioning, some 1000 people gathered outside. They hurled rocks and bottles, overturned a gypsy cab, smashed the windows of a police car and attempted to burn a city bus that the police were using to remove injured officers.

To prevent a riot, the police made a decision to move the investigation to the 24th precinct stationhouse on West 100th Street. The dozen suspects were released amidst promises by local leaders — including Rangel, the police later claimed — that they would voluntarily appear at the stationhouse. None did.

No one was ever convicted of Cardillo’s murder and the repercussions of the decision to release the suspects rippled through the department for the next decade. The bitterness was directed at Ward, who denied giving the order. “Someone else who was very high-ranking at the time made the decision,” he maintained.

The first official explanation came a year after the shooting in a secret police document, known as the Blue Book. Officially entitled “Report and Analysis of Muslim Mosque Incident of April 14, 1972,” it was prepared between March and June, 1973, under James Hannon, who had succeeded Codd when Murphy retired earlier that year.

The Blue book stated that Seedman, aware of the potential for a riot, had made “the reluctant decision” to adjourn the investigation to the 24th Precinct stationhouse at 151 W. 100th. St.

Explaining why he had ordered the suspects’ release, the report said Seedman “stated that the reason for this action was the fact that no police officers at the scene could identify any person remaining in the basement as being involved in the incident.”

But the Blue Book was never made public. According to the case’s grand jury report, it had been “only circulated among the upper ranks of the police department.”

It remained secret for ten years, until New York Newsday reporter Gerald McKelvey and Your Humble Servant reported its existence in late 1983 when Ward was about to be named commissioner.

Reached in 1983 at Alexander’s Department store in Queens, where he was head of security — he had retired two weeks after the shooting — Seedman said he had never heard of the Blue Book. But he acknowledged he had given the order to release the suspects. When asked why he hadn’t owned up to it before, Seedman answered, “What good would it have done?”

But that isn’t the end of the story. Far from it.

In his book, Jurgensen condemns Ward, not Seedman. He maintains that the Blue Book was fiction, designed to protect the bosses.

And now, retired captain Ed Mamet, a Seedman protégé, has come forward to say that although Seedman gave the order to release the suspects, he did so under duress — pressured by Ward and Rangel, after Seedman had unsuccessfully attempted to reach Murphy and Codd.

How Seedman could not have reached Murphy and Codd remains unclear. Murphy says he was at the hospital where Cardillo was taken, with then Mayor John Lindsay. He says he cannot recall where Codd was.

“I can’t accept that,” Murphy said. “We all had two-way radios. You had to reachable at all times.”

According to Mamet:

Seedman was so angered by Ward that in 1983 he gave Mamet a sealed envelope with what Seedman said was his grand jury testimony that he had written from memory.

Seedman instructed Mamet to give the envelope to Chris Borgen, then a CBS reporter and a former detective who had worked for Seedman in the narcotics bureau.

Seedman also said that Ward refused to give the release order himself, saying that as a deputy commissioner he was not in the uniformed chain of command. Instead, he told Seedman, “You’re the highest-ranking person – you order it.”

Seedman also claimed he had accepted Rangel’s word as an elected official that he would guarantee the suspects’ later appearance.

In 1983 Rangel denied to Newsday making any such guarantee. More recently, his spokesman did not return a phone call from this reporter.

Borgen never aired the report. He has since died. Ward and Codd are also dead.

Reached by telephone in Florida late last year, Seedman, who is now 88 years old, said, “I don’t remember anything about the mosque incident. How did you get my number? I have nothing to say.”

Now, the bow tie/bean pie guys do have some redeeming qualities. The same can not be said of the "Yahwehs," who are just off-the-wall bonkers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hebrew_Israelites

http://www.hebrewisraelites.net/

https://www.cofah.com/

Zendetta
4th August 07, 12:16 PM
I don't blame them for being radical separatists back when - I don't think it was an entirely unreasonable response to the '70s.

And they undeniably do some good for the community.

But Thugs-who-think-gods-on-their-side are some of my LEAST favorite folks.

Truculent Sheep
4th August 07, 12:19 PM
IRA was on my mind.

The logic is pretty obvious: you are fighting the system and you need ways to generate munny, but the economy is dominated by the establishment - which is probably most of why you are a revolutionary anyway.

Of course, the "Establishment" has its own share of connections to drugs, mafia, and other shenanigans (CIA, WHAT?!??!) And in many places, the privileged aristocratic class descends from an original gang of pirates and conquerors anyway.

With all due respect that does sound like a 'they're as bad as each other', relativist moral cop-out argument. It's easy to be cynical about one's own government when one hasn't lived under a true dictatorship. Most terrorist groups are extra-legal, while - at least in working democracies - the outfits fighting them work within the law. Of course, there are examples of collusion between loyalist terrorists and the British security services, but these are isolated cases when you consider how nasty state oppression can be.

Zendetta
4th August 07, 12:32 PM
Negative. I do think there is some legit need for some moral relativism in these situation, but I don't mention it to 'make the seem equal'. I just think the "Law 'n' Order" vs "Criminal Element" is a bit of a false dichotomy in need of deconstructing.

Many revolutionary movements come up from economic desperation due to the opposition controlling the means of wealth production. They are more or less forced into criminality as a direct result of economic marginalization. No saying its 'right' per se, just observing.

And, again, many societies begin with an original conquest by barbarians, whose descendants become an entitled aristocracy whose terms define what is "legal" and what ain't. Needless to say, these terms tend to favor the established social order, perhaps at the expense of the "underclass".

Zendetta
4th August 07, 12:36 PM
It's easy to be cynical about one's own government when one hasn't lived under a true dictatorship.

LOL - this is pretty much what I tell the whiney hippies out here:

"Police State? If this was a REAL 'police state' your ass would already have been 'disappeared' by the death squads by now."

Zendetta
4th August 07, 02:08 PM
news incoming:


OAKLAND, Calif. - Police are testing guns and other evidence recovered from raids that resulted in the arrest of seven members of an Oakland Black Muslim splinter group who police suspect were involved in the killing of a journalist and two others.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20121425/

Apparently the raids were already planned after a yearlong investigation into allegations of kidnapping, torture, and murder. So much for being My Brother's Keeper.

Another friend of mine works down the block from the Bakery that was raided. He asked a black coworker about the "Bow Tie/ Bean Pie" Posse. Her response?

"Thugs."

ICY
4th August 07, 08:05 PM
TS, until you've encountered, first-hand, the level of corruption in the police force, really, STFU. It's everywhere, all the time. Cops take bribes left and right, seize drugs from dealers that won't pay them and sell them to dealers that will, etc, etc, etc.

When my Mom recently took over the management of a couple apartment blocks that the dealers in town were "running" (used apartments to provide clients with a place to use, to deal from, to put kidnapped debtors in, etc) and told them to leave, they pulled out stacks of cash to bribe her. She said "No, you're just leaving", they were baffled, one guy actually stood there with mouth agape and said "What!? The cops all take the money!".

Mr. Jones
8th August 07, 02:41 PM
Let me just take this moment to state the mutha-fucking obvious:

Black Nationalist groups are just as retarded as White Nationalist Groups. Its no accident that some of their screeds read practically identical, just switching which group is the real Chosen Few and which are Satan's Spawn.

AND they both hate the Joos!

Black people actually have a reason to get upset and angry. White people really don't.


I don't blame them for being radical separatists back when - I don't think it was an entirely unreasonable response to the '70s.


Tell me why I have to do 35mph in a 35mph zone when everyone else is doing 45 or 50 and get back to me.

Mr. Jones
8th August 07, 02:43 PM
Is this the muslim bakery by that good hamburger place. I see Muslim women walking around there and me and other people stare at them thinking, "why the hell are you wearing that shit."

Zendetta
8th August 07, 03:34 PM
Black people actually are justified in being racist hatemongers. White people really are the devil.

Translated from the One Percenter.

Black people have alot of reasons to get upset. The biggest current cause of upset IMO should be that thugs have taken over their neighborhoods and hijacked black identity.

Of course, getting people to take responsibility for the consequences of their negative behaviors is tough. So much easier to blame a familiar enemy.

Of course, thats just my opinion as a priveleged white guy, right?

Please do tell why (if) you think the Black Muslim perspective is "justified"


Tell me why I have to do 35mph in a 35mph zone when everyone else is doing 45 or 50 and get back to me.

DWB is real, not gonna argue that. Sucks.

But if you want to debate, perhaps you can tell me how a race-murderer like Tookie Williams can murder a couple of Asians while calling them "Buddha Heads", kill some white folks to start a racewar, and then go on to be lionized instead of condemned for hate crimes?

Regardless, thugs do a lot more damage to black people than cops, period. Sorry to piss on your stereotype, but its real.

Case in point: Chauncey Bailey was shot by a black man.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20152364/

Mr. Jones
8th August 07, 03:43 PM
Jewish, Black, yellow, brown, red are justified for hating white people. White people are not justified for hating yellow, black, red or brown people. I'm not responsible for your ignorance Zendetta go read up about the history of the world and what white people did to everyone.

So all the criminal black people justify the police to treat us all like criminals Zendetta?

Zendetta
8th August 07, 04:01 PM
So all the criminal black people justify the police to treat us all like criminals Zendetta?

By your logic, clearly the answer is "yes".

Do the criminal actions of some white people justify that you treat us all like racist oppressors?

'Cuz what you are suggesting is the same racist hypocrisy that Yusuf Bey's thugs promulgate: that because some white folks have treated us badly, we are justified in righteously persecuting all white people.

I think thats racist garbage, but I'd love to hear you continue to rationalize hating an entire ethnic group because of the actions of some.

There is a word for that. Hint: starts with an "R".

You want to talk ignorance of history?

OK - slavery would have never become a transatlantic institution without black slave traders, and slavery still exists in Africa. Furthermore, the British Empire did more to end slavery worldwide, especially in Africa and the middle East, than any other group, ever.

Black nationalist try hard to portray racism as the sole province of white people. Pretty fucking obvious its a problem of human nature.

Truculent Sheep
8th August 07, 05:33 PM
TS, until you've encountered, first-hand, the level of corruption in the police force, really, STFU. It's everywhere, all the time. Cops take bribes left and right, seize drugs from dealers that won't pay them and sell them to dealers that will, etc, etc, etc.

All societies have bent coppers. But Canada's hardly fucking Belarus, is it?


When my Mom recently took over the management of a couple apartment blocks that the dealers in town were "running" (used apartments to provide clients with a place to use, to deal from, to put kidnapped debtors in, etc) and told them to leave, they pulled out stacks of cash to bribe her. She said "No, you're just leaving", they were baffled, one guy actually stood there with mouth agape and said "What!? The cops all take the money!".

Your family needs to move to a nicer area.

Zendetta
10th August 07, 09:52 PM
More:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20206676/

I was wrong about the murder weapon:it was a double barreled shotgun. The assassin apparently shot him, and then emptied the other shell into Bailey's face as he lay dying. Brutal shit.

Fuck these guys, I hope the Man brings down their whole house of cards.

ToUnderstand
15th August 07, 02:44 PM
As my friend from the NGE would say

All you 85% get off the white mans dick, we 5% know what we are doing, and all you 10% eat a dick.

Where i would quote bone thugs and harmony "if every one in the world smoked weed it would be alot better"

Zendetta
15th August 07, 03:04 PM
I love to smoke the herb, but i'm gonna need much more of it to figure out what the fuck you are saying.

Shawarma
15th August 07, 03:23 PM
I think you also need to get off the white mans dick. Or something?

Zendetta
15th August 07, 04:09 PM
It couldn't hurt. What the fuck is NGE anyway?

Shawarma
15th August 07, 04:32 PM
According to wikipedia, it is Neon Genesis Evangelion.

Cool, Understand's friend is a manga character.

Another possbility is that he meant these guys: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Nation_of_Gods_and_Earths

Zendetta
15th August 07, 06:39 PM
wiki:

Five Percenters also teach that Black people specifically, and the entire world population more generally, can be divided into three groups:

The 85%, who are the humble masses, mentally deaf, dumb, and blind to the truth about themselves and the world in which they live.
The 10%, who understand much of the truth but use it to their advantage to keep the 85% under their control through religion, politics, entertainment, economics, and other methods.
The 5%, who are the enlightened divine beings, having repossessed knowledge of the truth regarding the foundations of life and of oneself, and seek to liberate the 85% through education.


Pr'olly right. More Black People are the Master Race shit. Funny to me how the logic of racial identity is so universal among margianlized retards.

Also funny to me how people who usually trumpet for equality between the races are often so willing to give these bigots a pass.

Shawarma
15th August 07, 06:49 PM
Looks like these people go way beyond regular bigotry and far into the realms of karazy.

These people don't even seem to recognize God or any actual Muslim traditions apart from names and such. I especially like how A-L-L-A-H is somehow an acronym for Arm, leg, leg, arm, head. You know, an Arabic bastardization of a word having a hidden meaning in modern English.

I wish I was black - Black people seem to have more entertaining cook religions than white people, Rastafarians and these guys. Just look like the 5%ers pull their teachings straight out of their ass without the need for justifying their beliefs through ancient holy books.

I always lol at how black Americans convert to Islam because they feel that Christianity was the religion of slavetraders. Because no Muslims ever engaged in the trade of black slaves, oh no, not a one.

Zendetta
15th August 07, 06:53 PM
Yeah, no kidding. Islamic slaveholders thought african men made great harem gaurds - you just had to castrate them first. Slavery was an institution in the middle east well into the 20th century, and still exists in parts of Africa, or so I'm told.

AAAhmed46
15th August 07, 07:18 PM
Yep it does.

And once again blame goes on the ROYAL HOUSE OF SAUD, responsible for alot of it.

Mr. Jones
15th August 07, 09:05 PM
Zendetta's post are hilarious. I would rape him like he got raped in the other thread. But I don't like sloppy seconds.

Zendetta
15th August 07, 10:15 PM
LOL - And what thread is that, dipshit? Please do try and "rape" me - I am really interested in hearing you try to support the racist claims of black nationalists/separatists.

Calling you out Jones - step up. THat is assuming you are not too busy getting punked by the likes of Sushi.

ToUnderstand
16th August 07, 12:46 AM
Oh, if i may add my friend is a little of his rocker as you can tell he kind of believes he's god and all black me are god. Also dont forget that to the NGE Peace is an acronym for Pyrimids exemplify Allahs creative expertise. But NGE and NOI are both weird orginizations, they have very abstract beliefs to put it nicely. its actually more horrifying to me than the free masons. My friend was trying to teach me the supreme alphabet one day then i passed him the spliff and was quiet.

But in all respect to the subject i believe the NOI did it Farakhan and his ilk are no more than gangsters. Hell most of NOI and NGE is comproside of members from street gangs...

Zendetta
16th August 07, 12:55 AM
Awesome. Talking weird shit (with even stranger cats than yourself!) while getting stoned is timeless fun.

Its funny, because the Masons figure prominently in black conspiracy theories (seen the CD jacket for OutKast's ATLiens?), but groups like this often incorporate big elements of masonry into their lore. Probably descends from Prince Albert Lodges.

But, to clarify: the people that killed C. Bailey are not connected with NOI in any direct way. Splinter off a splinter, or something.

The 'teachings' of these types of groups is practically identical to that of white power groups - no suprise that both sides draw thugs with a message of messianic racial identity.

ToUnderstand
16th August 07, 01:08 AM
hell yeah man if you think my NGE friends is weird he's not nothing to some dreads i know. this dude puts VIBE in every sentence its funny at first then he gets redundent, but he has that Kali if you know what i mean. But i see your in the bay so you get Primo from Humboldt, Trinity, and Mendocino county you lucky bastard...

Zendetta
16th August 07, 03:34 PM
oh yeah, its all good out here, Baby! Plenty o' medicine for the sickness of Babylon....