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OZZ
22nd May 07, 12:54 PM
Last night I watched a somewhat disturbing documentary-type movie called "Off The Chain" ..a look into the underworld of illegal dog fighting in the US.
I found out a few things I didn't know Ie. it is legal in Japan and Mexico, there is an underground newspaper devoted to the 'sport' and not all matches are to the death.
Just curious what anyone might know about this 'sport' and if anybody has any first hand experience with it. Also wondering what people think from a moral perspective.
Is this cruel and inhumane? Or is it a 'sport' as some suggest?

Yiktin Voxbane
22nd May 07, 01:06 PM
The best dog fights are where you lace on a pair of Poodles and start swinging .

Neildo
22nd May 07, 02:10 PM
I've seen rooster fights in the philippines, but no dog fights. someone should bring the idea over there, it would be a good way to eliminate the stray dog problem.

in all seriousness, i like dogs, so i'm not big on pitfights. the whole process is pretty cruel, and i hope a few illegal dog fight trainers get their nuts bitten off.

PizDoff
22nd May 07, 02:45 PM
The best dog fights are where you lace on a pair of Poodles and start swinging .

Poodle-chucks?

Question!
22nd May 07, 02:45 PM
I was browsing through Sam Sheridan's book A Fighter's Heart and I read a page where he was writing about dog fighting. According to him, the best fighting dogs fight because they love to fight, were raised from dogs who loved to fight, and are treated really well by their owners, their owners genuinely love them and vice versa.

The assholes who mistreat their dogs get poor fighting dogs because there is no love, or something like that.

Commodore Pipes
22nd May 07, 03:34 PM
Poodle-chucks?

No, poodle wraps.

OZZ
22nd May 07, 05:26 PM
I was browsing through Sam Sheridan's book A Fighter's Heart and I read a page where he was writing about dog fighting. According to him, the best fighting dogs fight because they love to fight, were raised from dogs who loved to fight, and are treated really well by their owners, their owners genuinely love them and vice versa.

The assholes who mistreat their dogs get poor fighting dogs because there is no love, or something like that.

I can believe this to a degree..the film I watched made it out to seem that an owner really only likes his dog as long as it is winning money for him. Otherwise, they just see it as non profit and they kill it.
I am sure there are all kinds in that racket..

Stick
22nd May 07, 05:38 PM
As far as I know dog fighting has been illegal in the states for decades, but cock fighting is still legal in some places and was only recently made illegal in Oklahoma like 2 years ago; it was pretty ridiculous that I actually had to vote "yes" on a bill to ban cock fighting in 2004.

I had no idea dog fighting was legal in Japan, never saw it or any indication of it while I was there and I love fight sports- you would think I might have noticed a commercial or a referance or something.

Mexico.... yeah, that doesn't surprise me at all.

If you could really be sure that your dog really did love to fight, and that matches between dogs with such similair attitudes did not result in severe injury or death then maybe yeah I could get behind watching a dog fight, but the thing is you really can't know or guarantee that and all the dog fighting there is is universally cruel towards the dogs. Fuck that.

On the other hand, I love fighing with my own dog or with the good tempered dogs of friends and family. Playful wrestling wherein I've figured out that "yes, if you had to you really could kimura/key-lock/shoulder lock a dog and it would be fucking easy. Also, collar choke FTW" and they lightly bite and we roll around untill the dog is pinned; it's amazing that pinning a dog on its back, wrestling style, flips a switch in a dog's mind whereby it gives up and understands it has lost the game.

Zendetta
22nd May 07, 05:41 PM
Dog fights. Cruel? Picture MMA with biting, eyepokes, and alcohol.

Thinkchair
22nd May 07, 05:42 PM
I can believe this to a degree..the film I watched made it out to seem that an owner really only likes his dog as long as it is winning money for him. Otherwise, they just see it as non profit and they kill it.
I am sure there are all kinds in that racket..

Just because the owner harbors affection for his fighting dog, that does not make it right. He is still forcing the animal to encounter physical harm so that he can profit financially. No one wants to believe that what they are doing is wrong. So of course people are going to justify it by pointing to the love between dog and owner, or by saying that the dogs love to fight. These things are both possibly true, but the only reason why the dog in question likes to fight, is because it was severely mistreated in order to be shaped into a fighter. I am certainly no animal rights advocate, but I have to say I regard this exploitation as a kind of evil. I also have to wonder if this would make the owners, over time, more capable of treating humans in the same way.

WarPhalange
22nd May 07, 10:35 PM
I hate animal cruelty. I would have no scruples over killing an entire audience of people who went to a dog fight.

frumpleswift
22nd May 07, 10:45 PM
What we really need to bring back is bear baiting. Now that was a good and blodthirsty sport.

frumpleswift
22nd May 07, 10:46 PM
I hate animal cruelty. I would have no scruples over killing an entire audience of people who went to a dog fight.

This implies that you would have scruples under other circumstances?

WarPhalange
22nd May 07, 10:53 PM
Of course. Like, if it turned out that it wasn't a dog fight, but a dog show. I'd feel kind of bad then.

Zendetta
22nd May 07, 10:54 PM
What we really need to bring back is bear baiting. Now that was a good and blodthirsty sport.

You seen Borat Movie, yes?

"She's against cruelty to animals."

"Against?"

"WTF?!"

frumpleswift
22nd May 07, 10:54 PM
Of course. Like, if it turned out that it wasn't a dog fight, but a dog show. I'd feel kind of bad then.

I wouldn't. I've watched dog shows before, and they made me want to kill people.

Plus puppy mills (most places that raise purebreds) are only slightly less cruel than dog fighting.

AAAhmed46
22nd May 07, 11:28 PM
CBC did something on Dog fights in afganistan.

Since the taliban fell, it's gotten REALLY popular.

It's wierd though, it's never to the death and the winner's prize is pretty much that he gets to ride on his owners back, while the loser just...loses.

Didn't look very entertaining.:sleepy3: And stupid. Poor dogs. :spanky:

Zendetta
22nd May 07, 11:39 PM
THat sounds kind of cool, except that you probably can't drink Al Kohol in Muslem Kountry. Otherwise, Hicks is Hicks.

Now, full-contact Polo with a Dead Goat... that's a man's sport.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buzkashi

Steve
22nd May 07, 11:41 PM
THat sounds kind of cool, except that you probably can't drink Al Kohol in Muslem Kountry. Otherwise, Hicks is Hicks.

Now, full-contact Polo with a Dead Goat... that's a man's sport.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buzkashi

Holy shit, LOL!

+ rep incoming.

Kiko
23rd May 07, 06:37 AM
Making animals hurt themselves or one another is sick whether it's for money or some sort of warped thrill. On the other hand, treating dogs like people is pretty stupid, too.

It's too bad PETA doesn't go after dog-fight folks instead of annoying everyone else.

Truculent Sheep
23rd May 07, 07:32 AM
I've always preferred weasel fighting, myself:

65QwXDX6Ds0

bob
23rd May 07, 07:32 AM
Where I grew up having your dog stolen was a major hazard. If it was a fighting breed they'd use them for underground pit fights. If it wasn't they'd cut them, tie them to a line and drag them behind a boat for shark fishing (blood + struggling animal = good shark bait )

Kein Haar
23rd May 07, 11:00 AM
it's amazing that pinning a dog on its back, wrestling style, flips a switch in a dog's mind whereby it gives up and understands it has lost the game.

Not sure what kinda faggot ass dogs YOU wrestle with...but...

This involved a dispute for a toy, and a miscalculation:

http://www.vonsidener.com/finger.jpg

Of course, he's otherwise a disciplined, happy, well-trained little guy.

http://www.vonsidener.com/Arras.wmv

Performance bred German Shepherds FTW!

Shawarma
23rd May 07, 12:23 PM
Two points.

1. I am pretty unconcerned about animal suffering in general unless I happen to like the animal in question and think it's cute. As the master race on Earth, we get to decide what species lives or dies. Hence: Chickens and cows suffering, no worries, gorillas getting hunted, horrible tragedy.

2. I hate dogs

I got no problem with it. Wouldn't go to it either. Bloodshed for the sake of bloodshed I find distasteful.

OZZ
23rd May 07, 03:01 PM
Two points.

1. I am pretty unconcerned about animal suffering in general unless I happen to like the animal in question and think it's cute. As the master race on Earth, we get to decide what species lives or dies. Hence: Chickens and cows suffering, no worries, gorillas getting hunted, horrible tragedy.

2. I hate dogs

I got no problem with it. Wouldn't go to it either. Bloodshed for the sake of bloodshed I find distasteful.

Your compassion is overwhelming..

frumpleswift
23rd May 07, 06:07 PM
Making animals hurt themselves or one another is sick whether it's for money or some sort of warped thrill. On the other hand, treating dogs like people is pretty stupid, too.

Agreed. That is why it is imperative that we bring back gladitorial combat so we can sate our blood lust in a more civilised fashion.


It's too bad PETA doesn't go after dog-fight folks instead of annoying everyone else.

PETA makes me want to start wearing fur and get a bear baiting club going.

Kiko
23rd May 07, 06:24 PM
What about if we found a way to make PETA folk fight one another in a ring?

billy sol hurok
23rd May 07, 06:59 PM
Making animals hurt themselves or one another is sick whether it's for money or some sort of warped thrill. On the other hand, treating dogs like people is pretty stupid, too.

I know you mean well, but please don't put these two concepts into the same paragraph. Feeding a dog gunpowder to blister his stomach and make him "meaner" exists in a different universe from putting a tutu on your teacup poodle.


It's too bad PETA doesn't go after dog-fight folks instead of annoying everyone else.
Yeah, with M16s and body armor.* Where's the "armed wing" of "activists" when you need 'em? Shooting paintballs at rich ladies, I guess.

------
*At a minimum. There's big money in this shit, and one would have to expect a lot of return fire.

WarPhalange
23rd May 07, 09:27 PM
Where I grew up having your dog stolen was a major hazard. If it was a fighting breed they'd use them for underground pit fights. If it wasn't they'd cut them, tie them to a line and drag them behind a boat for shark fishing (blood + struggling animal = good shark bait )

Those kinds of people? Those are the ones I'd like to skin alive.

Question!
23rd May 07, 09:29 PM
I hate Shawarma.

Stick
24th May 07, 12:50 AM
Not sure what kinda faggot ass dogs YOU wrestle with...but...

This involved a dispute for a toy, and a miscalculation:

http://www.vonsidener.com/finger.jpg

Dude, tell me that is your hand! That is fuckinig gnarly!

Yes, I said "gnarly".


Of course, he's otherwise a disciplined, happy, well-trained little guy.

http://www.vonsidener.com/Arras.wmv

Performance bred German Shepherds FTW!

I play with mutts retrievers and boxers- no one I know has a German Sheppard, pitbull, rottie, or dobberman- some big dogs (100+ lbs some of 'em), but none are trained and most are strongly discouraged when it comes to violence. So yes, they're all ghey, but frankly- even with your gnarly finger picture- I am not bothered by the idea of fighting one dog.

More than one dog however......

Yiktin Voxbane
24th May 07, 01:12 AM
Cerebus ?

Sun Wukong
24th May 07, 03:39 AM
Where I grew up having your dog stolen was a major hazard. If it was a fighting breed they'd use them for underground pit fights. If it wasn't they'd cut them, tie them to a line and drag them behind a boat for shark fishing (blood + struggling animal = good shark bait )

you know, sometimes I can scarcely believe that austrailia was ever the worlds largest penal colony. good times.

Kein Haar
24th May 07, 09:50 AM
Luckily, that is not MY finger.

He's a local breeder in a dog community I frequent.

My wounds are but minor and incidental.