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Iscariot
19th February 07, 11:33 AM
Since our hard working and devoted staff haven't entertained us with one of these in a while, I thought I'd take over this week. Don't worry, normal service will no doubt be resumed next week, if only because they don't like their power being usurped.

It's Oscar time again (it's less than a week away) and instead of the cliched and pointless 'Which film will win Best Picture' idea (pointless because I doubt that anyone on these forums has actually seen every film in this year's shortlist) I have decided that we'll do classics that we can all relate to - Teen Movies.

We all have been, and some probably still are, teenagers. Living in the Western world we've seen portrayals of that time in our lives. This week's poll is very simple: Which teen movie is the best?

Take into account all the usual criteria you'd use for deeming a film 'The Best'; acting, script, dialogue, costumes, locations etc. and add in the most important factor, will it continue to be relevent? This should be the defining quality of the best teen film, it should represent and entertain using teen life, not that of a moment in history. The teen film should represent teenagers, not young people in a particular decade or setting.

For example The Manchurian Candidate fails to be timeless to modern audiences as the paranoia created by threat of Soviet infiltration cannot be replicated in modern audiences by the film, whereas the paranoia created in Siegel's Invasion of The Body Snatchers is still effective as it does not date itself.

On to the choices. I tried to select that appeal to both genders (which eliminated things like The Craft and Weird Science) and used teenagers as protagonists (eliminating the majority of the Askewniverse and Wayne's World).

In chronological order:

1. Grease (1978)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0077631/
The only musical on the list and the oldest in both production and setting. Grease was the only film suggested by a trawl through the IMDB for ideas, it never occured to me as a 'teen film' but a quick review of the plot and setting places it firmly in the category. Love it or hate it (personally I really hate it) everyone knows Grease, it's the film that gets repeated every three weeks on free TV, the film that proves Travolta was not always as cool as Vincent Vega and the film that lauched the adolescent stroke fantasy of the late 70s; Olivia Neutron-Bomb.

2. Fast Times at Ridgemont High (1982)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0083929/
Arguably the first true teen film. FTARH was the genre template for the next 25 years, loser protagonist, gross out jokes and gratuitous nudity (Thank you Phoebe Cates). Without FTARH the genre would either be non-existent or in a completely different form, its success allowed the genre to exist and expand, leading a couple of years later to the birth of the career of the great auteur of teen films, John Hughes.

3. The Breakfast Club (1985)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0088847/
The film that formed the sterotypes of the teen movie, and then destroyed them. The odd group forced to interact in detention removed the characters from their cmfort zones and support circles and forced them to exist. This film is arguably the deepest of the teen films, almost every scene having alternate and more indepth readings.

4. Ferris Bueller's Day Off (1986)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0091042/
After dealing with the indepth drama of The Breakfast Club's socio-political metaphors, Hughes then takes the genre to its other extreme, the comedy daydream. Broderick's Bueller decides to simply enjoy himself for a day, along with his girlfriend (the delectable Mia Sara) and his best friend Cameron (who would later captain the USS Enterprise).

5. Dazed and Confused (1993)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0106677/
Probably the least well known of the selection, Linklater's commentary on the end of the school year is one of the few to focus on the age conflict between students rather than between students and parents/teachers. The traditional device of using clique group conflict as a basis for narrative is ignored and results in a much more realistic portrayal of the teen social ecosystem.

6. Mallrats (1995)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113749/
The only one of the Askewniverse that actually qualified for inclusion (all the others use 20 somethings as their protagonists). This deserved its place representing Smith's influence on youth culture. Mallrats follows TS and Brodie in their not-so-straight-forward quest to reunite with their girlfriends. Assistance provided by Jay and Silent Bob.

7. American Pie (1999)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0163651/
"This one time on Sociocide, I wrote a weekly poll!" The epitome of the teen gross out comedy. This is the genre piece of the collection, taking everything from other films and going that one step further - for better or worse. American Pie is the synergy of the films before it, love it or hate it you'd be hard pressed not to find your favourite teen film influencing it in some way.

8. Ghost World (2001)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0162346/
For a long time I suspected that teen films could only be understood by teenagers, or those who could relate to their own teenage years. I would not expect my parents to understand the subtlety of The Breakfast Club in a way that myself or others of the modern generation would. This film confirmed my thesis. I simply did not get it. It came highly recommended from another film student, I followed the narrative fine....I just didn't get it.

9. Napoleon Dynamite (2004)
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0374900/
The car crash of the bunch. Napoleon Dynamite forces you to cringe throughout, not from the onscreen antics, but because of the viewer's reflection on their own life. Napoleon Dynamite is a home movie for everyone, a snapshot of everything embarrasing about your life that you still will never throw away.

10. These all suck (????)
http://www.imdb.com/
Well suggest something smartarse! I only had ten options and I had to give a broad example of the genre. It caused me to drop a lot (John Hughes down to two entries? Unbelieveable!) and completely omit certain things that I rate very highly (Bill and Ted's Excellent Adventure, Heathers, S.F.W. etc).



There you are Sociocide, vote/post for the best now, your opinion matters*

*It really doesn't, I already know which is the best, if your opinion is different then you're wrong.

frumpleswift
19th February 07, 11:38 AM
You fail at teh poll.

Also, no Better off Dead?

Stick
19th February 07, 02:14 PM
Yeah, I've been kind of a lay-about what witht he poll these last couple weeks.... oops.

I have yet to see Ghost world (want to see this one though), Dazed and Confused, or Napolean Dynamite.

Of the others, I had a hard time between the Breakfast Club, Ferris, and Mallrats... ultimately I had to go with Mallrats.

"Son of Jor-el, kneel before Zod!"

Oh, and just because it's the weekly poll doesn't mean it has to go in ground zero, this is very much for the movies, music, & mayhem forum.

Moved.

WarPhalange
19th February 07, 02:46 PM
Yeah, teen movies suck.

Coldelf-Talons
19th February 07, 03:12 PM
Where the fuck is 16 Candles, and Pretty in Pink!! omg Molly Ringwald is hawt.

Coldelf-Talons
19th February 07, 03:14 PM
Also, Ghostworld was boring as hell.

How people acctually liked Napolean Dynomite still puzzles me to this day, I have rewatched it a couple times to see if it grows on you. It just sucks more each time I do watch it.

All the others on the list are good. I voted Dazed and Confused.

Neildo
19th February 07, 05:55 PM
While reading this thread a song from Ferris Bueller popped in my head, so i voted for that one.

Steve
19th February 07, 08:15 PM
Voted for Dazed and Confused since it's the only one that I own.

bob
19th February 07, 08:18 PM
Ferris Bueller.

I loved Dazed and Confused but I didn't really see it as a teenager so it doesn't count.

I think you could have put Lost Boys in there as well. I loved that flick as a kid.

emboesso
19th February 07, 08:29 PM
I didn't see "Dazed" as a teenager either, but it was about the years that I was a teenager. The hair, the clothes, the cars, the music, it was dead on.

Hard not to cast a vote for "Ridgemont High" based on the Pheobe Cates topless scene.

And I'll never understand "Grease". A few years back they had a 25 year anniversary for its release. So everyone in the 2000s got sentimental about how in the 1970s we were sentimental about the 1950s.

Dagon Akujin
20th February 07, 12:00 AM
What?!? No "What's Eating Gilbert Grape (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuSzAIFw2oU)"? How could you?

Dagon

Anna Kovacs
20th February 07, 12:01 AM
I thought Greese was a lot of fun but voted for napolean dynamite because it was something I could relate to more because I was a loser.

Steve
20th February 07, 12:13 AM
And I'll never understand "Grease". A few years back they had a 25 year anniversary for its release. So everyone in the 2000s got sentimental about how in the 1970s we were sentimental about the 1950s.

I guess some people do understand: http://www.nbc.com/Grease/index.shtml


I thought Greese was a lot of fun

Yup, it was fun. But something that I could never identify with.


but voted for napolean dynamite because it was something I could relate to more because I was a loser.

Me too, but I was way more insecure than Napoleon.

Iscariot
20th February 07, 12:16 AM
You fail at teh poll.
I succeed at teh poll, I was writing it whilst you posted.


Also, no Better off Dead?
I only had 10 options and had to give a broad range.


Oh, and just because it's the weekly poll doesn't mean it has to go in ground zero, this is very much for the movies, music, & mayhem forum.
My bad, I stuck it with the others.


Where the fuck is 16 Candles, and Pretty in Pink!! omg Molly Ringwald is hawt.
Ringwald is represented by The Breakfast Club, I only had 10 options....


Also, Ghostworld was boring as hell.

How people acctually liked Napolean Dynomite still puzzles me to this day, I have rewatched it a couple times to see if it grows on you. It just sucks more each time I do watch it.
That's my point about those two, I don't think older people can 'get' them anymore. We can watch an older teen flick that is timeless and still get it, but eventually the genre changes and we grow up.


While reading this thread a song from Ferris Bueller popped in my head, so i voted for that one.
This one?
B-l55LR0jdc


I think you could have put Lost Boys in there as well. I loved that flick as a kid.
I only had 10 options....


Hard not to cast a vote for "Ridgemont High" based on the Pheobe Cates topless scene.
And that scene is now firmly entrenched in modern pop culture thanks to Fountains of Wayne:
5V_rXTp1yBU
Most of the people who like that will never know of the homage, which is a shame.


What?!? No "What's Eating Gilbert Grape (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuSzAIFw2oU)"? How could you?
I ONLY HAD 10 OPTIONS!

bob
20th February 07, 12:40 AM
I realise, strictly speaking, the 'teen movie' is a Hollywood phenomenom but a lot of my favourite movies about teenagers (and for teenagers) are from elsewhere.

eg.

Y tu mama tambien (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0245574/) (2001) from Mexico

Small Faces (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0114474/plotsummary) (1996) Scotland

The Big Steal (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099138/) (1990) Australia

also a couple of American indies -

Election (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0126886/) (1999)

Kids (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113540/) (1995)

Iscariot
20th February 07, 12:50 AM
I realise, strictly speaking, the 'teen movie' is a Hollywood phenomenom but a lot of my favourite movies about teenagers (and for teenagers) are from elsewhere.

eg.

Y tu mama tambien (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0245574/) (2001) from Mexico

Small Faces (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0114474/plotsummary) (1996) Scotland

The Big Steal (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0099138/) (1990) Australia

also a couple of American indies -

Election (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0126886/) (1999)

Kids (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0113540/) (1995)
I'd probably put Election in the teen movie genre, particularly with the casting of Broderick as a foil to his Bueller role, though I'd say Kids is a social commentary film with more in common with the Ken Loach British Realism type of films.

The question then, is the teen movie a purely American reserve? What examples and criteria do we have for non-American teen movies if they exist?

Steve
20th February 07, 12:50 AM
Kids should be show in sex ed classes, IMO.

With a bowl of free condoms near the exit.

Dagon Akujin
20th February 07, 01:08 AM
What?!? No "What's Eating Gilbert Grape (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZuSzAIFw2oU)"? How could you?

Dagon


I ONLY HAD 10 OPTIONS!

I think you missed the point. *click click*

Dagon "winkie winkie" Akujin

Iscariot
20th February 07, 01:29 AM
I think you missed the point. *click click*

Dagon "winkie winkie" Akujin
Ah, now I see, I was typing my response when I noticed that post so just looked at the name rather than the link, my bad.

bob
20th February 07, 02:34 AM
I'd probably put Election in the teen movie genre, particularly with the casting of Broderick as a foil to his Bueller role, though I'd say Kids is a social commentary film with more in common with the Ken Loach British Realism type of films.

The question then, is the teen movie a purely American reserve? What examples and criteria do we have for non-American teen movies if they exist?

'Teen movie' is probably a Hollywood genre with all the associated conventions like jocks and proms and gross out humour.

Movies about teenagers and for teenagers could be from anywhere, although there is probably a lot of crossover with the 'coming of age' movie.

Iscariot
20th February 07, 02:48 AM
'Teen movie' is probably a Hollywood genre with all the associated conventions like jocks and proms and gross out humour.

Movies about teenagers and for teenagers could be from anywhere, although there is probably a lot of crossover with the 'coming of age' movie.
I'd put The Breakfast Club firmly in the teen movie genre yet that doesn't use gross out humour, it does have stereotypes but quickly moves past and destroys them.

Does The Breakfast Club not 'qualify' as a teen movie? Or are we automatically concentrating on the more recent slew of gross out films, the American Pie/Road Trip series?

bob
20th February 07, 03:22 AM
I'd put The Breakfast Club firmly in the teen movie genre yet that doesn't use gross out humour, it does have stereotypes but quickly moves past and destroys them.

Does The Breakfast Club not 'qualify' as a teen movie? Or are we automatically concentrating on the more recent slew of gross out films, the American Pie/Road Trip series?

A film doesn't have to have all the stereotypes. Breakfast Club certainly has quite a few of them. I don't remember it all that well but it has the usual tension between the cliques, the Seymour Skinner badass teacher, the outsider hooking up with the cool kid (, the feel good ending where everyone realises how much they have in common after all.

It was well written and well made and perhaps in comparison to Porky's or American Pie it was unconventional but it still had a lot of stereotypes.

Anna Kovacs
20th February 07, 11:33 AM
Since teenagers are all about sterotypes I'd say that's ok. I don't think there's been a teenager invented that hasnt fit into some sterotype.

WarPhalange
22nd February 07, 12:49 AM
Yup. You're from the south, all right.

Anna Kovacs
22nd February 07, 01:18 AM
GOSH DON'T STEROTYPE ME

Mr. Jones
22nd February 07, 03:12 AM
Since teenagers are all about sterotypes I'd say that's ok. I don't think there's been a teenager invented that hasnt fit into some sterotype.

The guy who plays magic the gathering at lunch time with his geeky friends but is still considered cool but the majority of the student body?

Steve
22nd February 07, 03:32 AM
The one that's selling pot?

Mr. Jones
22nd February 07, 03:37 AM
no

Steve
22nd February 07, 04:07 AM
You'd be more popular if you sold pot.

WarPhalange
22nd February 07, 09:33 AM
You have to remember that the majority of the student body are idiots.

Kiko
22nd February 07, 10:39 AM
I know the thread's mostly over, but. I did like Ferris, voted for Breakfast Club. You left out "Dead Poet's Society".

Iscariot
22nd February 07, 10:42 AM
I think I would have omitted it on grounds of being gender specific, as Mona Lisa Smile is the female version as well. Plus I count it as more of a coming of age drama than a teen movie.

Kiko
22nd February 07, 10:44 AM
Ah, no wonder I liked it better. Good point, but I'm still not sure why gender specific negates the teen aspect. Your poll your rules tho. ;)
New poll then. Don't forget "Scent of a Woman" for that one.
I'll be so torn!

Iscariot
22nd February 07, 11:02 AM
Good point, but I'm still not sure why gender specific negates the teen aspect.
Gender specific does negate it being a teen film, but I think Dead Poet's Society is more of a coming of age drama than a teen movie. I decided not to include gender specific films (i.e. The Craft, Weird Science) to limit my choices. I only had ten, and every other post has been 'You should have included....'

Kiko
22nd February 07, 11:05 AM
You can't please everyone, can you? Let THEM make a poll if they're not happy, right? ;)

Anna Kovacs
22nd February 07, 05:34 PM
The guy who plays magic the gathering at lunch time with his geeky friends but is still considered cool but the majority of the student body?


I knew plenty of people who played magic but still were "cool".


Even the "anti-sterotype" types are really just a sterotype. Pretty much everyone between the ages of 12 and 20 fit right in their own neat little box

WarPhalange
22nd February 07, 08:58 PM
You said "between" right? Meaning that I am an individual now?

Kiko
23rd February 07, 07:09 AM
Individuals can be put in boxes whether by themselves or others. It's getting out that makes for a good film... or life.

billy sol hurok
23rd February 07, 08:09 AM
I voted for Gidgit (http://www.hollyrude.com/images/big/22224326073820733full.jpg).

Okay, not really. But I'd be interested in hearing why it -- and not Fast Times -- is not the first true teen film.

Yiktin Voxbane
23rd February 07, 10:27 AM
The 10 from my era would have been ....

Tron
Dracula AD. 72
Porkys
It's alive
Dirty Harry
Altered States
Dead or Alive
Billy Jack
Young Frankenstein
Silent Movie

But then again, the world was a different place, /Wheeeeze, back then .

billy sol hurok
23rd February 07, 10:37 AM
The 10 from my era would have been ....

Tron
Dracula AD. 72
Porkys
It's alive
Dirty Harry
Altered States
Dead or Alive
Billy Jack
Young Frankenstein
Silent Movie

But then again, the world was a different place, /Wheeeeze, back then .
Not sure I'm seeing the "teen" connection in some of those.

Fun fact (for old farts): Glum old Tom Laughlin -- yes, Billy Jack hisself -- was in Gidgit . . . as "Lover Boy" of all things.

Iscariot
23rd February 07, 12:34 PM
I voted for Gidgit (http://www.hollyrude.com/images/big/22224326073820733full.jpg).

Okay, not really. But I'd be interested in hearing why it -- and not Fast Times -- is not the first true teen film.
50s Beach Movies are a recognised sub-genre of the time, they didn't move out of their era in their current form, substantial changes occurred. FTARH does certainly follow on from the evolution of teens in films, but it set a standard for the genre that has remained unchanged for over 20 years. If you reshot FTARH today, shot for shot, line for line just in a modern setting it'd still be relevent, funny and make sense.

FTARH codified the generic conventions, all films since are measured (whether the person analysing it realises or not) against the mark set by it.

Feryk
13th December 12, 05:24 PM
Fast Times at Ridgemont High.

Phoebe Cates' Tits FTW!!!!!

Robot Jesus
13th December 12, 05:47 PM
And not a single vote for grease, Ford's in his fiver and all is right on sociocide.

Spade: The Real Snake
13th December 12, 06:33 PM
...and you wonder why? (http://gifsoup.com/webroot/animatedgifs/71926_o.gif)

nihilist
13th December 12, 10:57 PM
There aren't any goddamn teens in Grease.

Harpy
14th December 12, 12:59 AM
I liked TMNT as a young teen. Had an older cousin who watched Grease fricken everyday and when we had sleepover she'd wake us up by blaring the overused Grease VHS on tv. Good times.

Harpy
14th December 12, 01:00 AM
Gremlins!!