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View Full Version : Fraudulent Bush Memos Linked to DNC



Rigante
20th September 04, 11:51 AM
Well here we have it. The fraudulent Bush memos are now linked to the DNC. Bill Burkett who made the documents and which CBS now admits are a fraud has also reported that the documents have been in the hands of Max Cleland. Cleland is part of the Kerry campaign. So the deception has come back to roost. So where are the apologies from the DNC, Kerry and CBS for fraud and attempting to decieve the public?

Jo Vale Tudo
20th September 04, 12:07 PM
Well CBS apologized to America now:

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/09/20/politics/main644539.shtml

Chupacabra
20th September 04, 12:13 PM
Oh man, no one saw that one comming.

Rigante
20th September 04, 12:18 PM
Now where is Kerry and the DNC. This is starting to turn into another Watergate. Has CBS not yet explained why it pushed forward with the memos even though the wife and son of the alleged memo author said it was fake prior to their airing of the story? If they were fair and balanced they would have held back and did a thorough investigation before they launced the episode. The head of the DNC said they had no knowledge of the document when asked earlier. Now it appears they did. And of course we all know that fast John wouldnt have had anything to do with it either even though he just happened to go back on the campaign trail focusing on Bush's Vietnam era record and the same time the memo's mysteriously appeared.

PeedeeShaolin
20th September 04, 12:25 PM
The entire NAVY said that Kerry's records are all in order but you never see Bush or the Republicans asking for forgiveness even though Bush's campaign lawyer was their advice man do you?

Why should one party act differently than the other?

Dochter
20th September 04, 12:29 PM
Any readily available documentation of these links Rigante?

I haven't been following the political diatribes lately.

PeedeeShaolin
20th September 04, 12:34 PM
The only real change is that CBS is unable to verify that the records are genuine, which we've been told would be impossible without the original.

Rigante
20th September 04, 12:58 PM
PeeDee where were you when the RNC got in trouble over watergate. They could have used you as a spokesperson! Foxnews is reporting that Bill Burkett has fingered Max Cleland who is part of the DNC. I know you dont like Fox as you prefer the Constant Bull Shit network but it might be worth looking over there.

PeedeeShaolin
20th September 04, 01:12 PM
FOX reports alot of things. Its the most bullshit network there is.

Dont get me wrong, this may be true, I could really care less either way, but why didn't you attack the Bush Administration when it was confirmed that Bush's campaign lawyer was the advisor for the Swift Boat Vets? And the Navy said that the records back Kerry.

If you think I find it unbelievable that Kerry's crew could have done this you'd be wrong, but I'd still wonder why you didn't say anything when the opposite side was doing the same.

CaptShady
20th September 04, 01:14 PM
Originally posted by PeedeeShaolin
FOX reports alot of things. Its the most bullshit network there is.

Dont get me wrong, this may be true, I could really care less either way, but why didn't you attack the Bush Administration when it was confirmed that Bush's campaign lawyer was the advisor for the Swift Boat Vets? And the Navy said that the records back Kerry.

If you think I find it unbelievable that Kerry's crew could have done this you'd be wrong, but I'd still wonder why you didn't say anything when the opposite side was doing the same.

You attacked the Swifties and the Bush campaign .. where's your condemnation here?

Leodom
20th September 04, 01:16 PM
Originally posted by PeedeeShaolin
The entire NAVY said that Kerry's records are all in order but you never see Bush or the Republicans asking for forgiveness even though Bush's campaign lawyer was their advice man do you?

Why should one party act differently than the other?

You are either stupid, ignorant, or intellectually dishonest.

The Kerry campaign and the 527 organization "MoveOn.org" share a lawyer as well. There are a limited number of lawyers who understand the new campaign finance laws. There is bound to be some overlap. At least the Republicans' lawyer attempted to remove the "appearance of impropriety" by resigning. You'll find that the Democrat lawyer is still working for both organizations.

The Navy has also stated that Kerry has not authorized the release of ALL his records. What he has authorized for release is there, but it is incomplete.

PeedeeShaolin
20th September 04, 01:17 PM
Turnabout is fairplay my friend.

Leodom
20th September 04, 01:22 PM
Originally posted by spincycle0
...We all know bush failed to do his job in the military regardless of what documents cbs has.

I'll ignore your initial BS and only address this portion.

Who knows that Bush failed to do his job? If he hadn't, he would not have had an honorable discharge. Air National Guard members work on a point system and are required to accrue a minimum of 50 points a year. Following are Bush's annual points accruals:

May 1968 to May 1969 253 points
May 1969 to May 1970 340 points
May 1970 to May 1971 137 points
May 1971 to May 1972 112 points
May 1972 to May 1973 56 points
May 1973 to May 1974 56 points

Bush did his job. In case you can't count, that's 6 years.

Dochter
20th September 04, 01:26 PM
Originally posted by Leodom
The Kerry campaign and the 527 organization "MoveOn.org" share a lawyer as well. There are a limited number of lawyers who understand the new campaign finance laws. There is bound to be some overlap. At least the Republicans' lawyer attempted to remove the "appearance of impropriety" by resigning. You'll find that the Democrat lawyer is still working for both organizations.
For the billionth time here is the difference: Those links are acknowledged. The Swift boat connections have been disavowed. For christs sake moveon's head is part of the higher up group for Kerry.

If Kerry said he had no connections (different than control) with move on you'd be right. As it is you're not.

Rigante
20th September 04, 01:26 PM
Peedee do you know about professional confidentiality requirements?. The attorney that worked for the Bush campaign was barred from discussing his other cases with the Bush campaign due to professional confidentiality requiremens. I cant tell the spouse of a patient of mine anything without his/her express permission and the same requirements apply to attorneys. Also under current elections laws he was also forbidden to discuss it with the Bush campaign. Do you have any proof that the attorney discussed the Swift boat campaign details with the RNC?

Rigante
20th September 04, 02:39 PM
Go look at the CBS news site. Despite the fact that documents they are fraudulent they keep repeating all the little nasties that are in the forged documents. Then they highlight that the secretary of the alleged author (Bush's CO) said the documents werent true but the sentiment was real. Yet just above they mention "some relatives" of the former CO didnt believe the documents were real but fails to mention and/or highlight that these "relatives" were the wife and son of the deceased CO. Now Peedee how is this fair and balanced?

Of course CBS shouldnt have questioned documents from a man known for a long standing Vendetta against Bush. They should just assume he was an honest man. They should just assume that the wife and son were liars and that a secretary was a better witness . Or perhaps poor CBS couldnt afford the cost to get independant verification of the documents. It also was just coincidence that they decided to drop this bombshell the week after the RNC convention.

cyrijl
21st September 04, 02:18 PM
well, even the talking heads were saying days ago these probably came from burkitt. And it seems from the reports i have heard that he is a little nutty. I don't blame kerry or those immediately around him for this. This lies at the foot of cbs.

Rigante
24th September 04, 12:24 PM
It looks like the link btw the DNC and the fraudulent memo's are becoming tightened. Maybe its time for a congressional investigation here.


"In an interview with the Fort-Worth Star Telegram published Friday, Burkett said that during a single phone conversation with Lockhart a senior adviser to Democratic presidential nominee John Kerry's (search) campaign Burkett suggested a "couple of concepts on what I thought [Kerry] had to do" to beat Bush.

In return, he said, Lockhart tried to "convince me as to why I should give them the documents."

Lockhart has maintained that he only listened to Burkett for three to four minutes during a phone conversation that took place after CBS called the Kerry adviser to tell him Burkett might have some information for the campaign. The former Clinton White House spokesman also said the topic of the Texas Air National Guard memos never came up, and that Burkett only talked about different ways the Kerry campaign could counter attack ads being launched by the Swift Boat Veterans"

The Mad Hatter
24th September 04, 02:30 PM
It looks like the link btw the DNC and the fraudulent memo's are becoming tightened. Maybe its time for a congressional investigation here.

Oh shut the fuck up Rigante. Both campaigns are slinging shit at each other and no one is appologizing for it. Quit being such a tool.

Both Bush and Kerry are crooks, and neither one deserve the office. Both would and do bring shame to the title of President. When is a viable 3rd party going to surface that can compete with these Washington Republicrats? Of course after a while that would leave future elections to be decided between 3 crooks instead of 2.

Rigante
24th September 04, 02:36 PM
No, I wont shut up and you can kiss my ass!:D

joen00b
24th September 04, 02:46 PM
Originally posted by Leodom
You are either stupid, ignorant, or intellectually dishonest.

The Kerry campaign and the 527 organization "MoveOn.org" share a lawyer as well. There are a limited number of lawyers who understand the new campaign finance laws. There is bound to be some overlap. At least the Republicans' lawyer attempted to remove the "appearance of impropriety" by resigning. You'll find that the Democrat lawyer is still working for both organizations.

The Navy has also stated that Kerry has not authorized the release of ALL his records. What he has authorized for release is there, but it is incomplete.

Since we're on the subject of SBVfT (Swift Boat Veterans for Truth) and their connections, let's see.

2 of the major financiers for SBVfT were George Bush Sr's personal Financial advisor and the Lt Governor for George Bush Jr's tenure in the role of Governor for Texas. These 2 individuals also paid George Bush 20 MILLION dollars to appear at a Fundraiser for his re-election campaign. This is of course because George Bush changed the rules on monetary income for re-election campaigns.

How's that for a connection?

Rigante
24th September 04, 02:56 PM
Assuming tbe above is true, can you show me what laws were violated.

joen00b
24th September 04, 03:32 PM
I think we already hit on the 527 Organizations and how they run in concert with Political Campaigns. It's very, very close to being illegal, but not quite. Even if it was, there would be know way to convict them, they're rich, rich people don't go to jail for stuff like this.

I can't say for certain, but I thought it was illegal for candidates to receive money from these 527 organizations as well, and 20 Million dollars sure seems like a lot of soft money...

Rigante
24th September 04, 03:48 PM
According to John McCain who I believe was on the writers of the bill that became law, he says its not being interpreted and enforced properly. As to who created that screwed up piece of legislation you would have to include all the Senators and Congressmen who voted in favor of the bill in addition to president. I really dont know but how did Kerry and Kennedy vote on that bill?

Deadpan Scientist
24th September 04, 03:49 PM
Originally posted by The Mad Hatter
Oh shut the fuck up Rigante. Both campaigns are slinging shit at each other and no one is appologizing for it. Quit being such a tool.

Both Bush and Kerry are crooks, and neither one deserve the office. Both would and do bring shame to the title of President. When is a viable 3rd party going to surface that can compete with these Washington Republicrats? Of course after a while that would leave future elections to be decided between 3 crooks instead of 2.

Never. Go do a aearch for user The Wastrel words: third party

joen00b
24th September 04, 03:55 PM
Originally posted by Rigante
According to John McCain who I believe was on the writers of the bill that became law, he says its not being interpreted and enforced properly. As to who created that screwed up piece of legislation you would have to include all the Senators and Congressmen who voted in favor of the bill in addition to president. I really dont know but how did Kerry and Kennedy vote on that bill?

I honestly don't know too much about the soft money cap from the 527 Orgs. I'll gladly admit that, I do recall reading there were possible problems with the people being so close to Bush, then holding a rally for him after releasing the commercials.

And I have no clue what Kennedy and Kerry's vote on the Bill has to do with anything here. That's a blatant attempt to distract from the issue.

Rigante
24th September 04, 04:05 PM
No, I am not trying to distract from the issue. The is point that people keep calling it Bush's bill. Remember the President does not make the bills, they are made by Senators and Congressman. Unless there is an overwhelming majority of one party in both houses, then they would have to been voted for by members of both parties. If it gets to the president then he/she either signs the bill or rejects it or if it is the right time of the year can do a pocket veto. As such it cant just be "Bush's bill", the Democrats had to help. Thats why I asked about Kerry since he is the presidential candidate and Kennedy is one of the chief leaders of the Democrats in the Senate. I think that their support or rejection of the bill is definately valid. If they didnt support it. then kudos for them and a point in their favor.

joen00b
24th September 04, 04:07 PM
I never called it Bush's Bill, I simply stated he is obviously benefitting from it in the gray areas of the Bill. There's nothing stopping Kerry from doing the same thing... except contributors!

Rigante
24th September 04, 04:59 PM
Sorry, I must have misunderstood you when you were referring to Bush having changed the rules for monetary support for re-election.:confused:

Leodom
24th September 04, 06:16 PM
Originally posted by joen00b
I never called it Bush's Bill, I simply stated he is obviously benefitting from it in the gray areas of the Bill. There's nothing stopping Kerry from doing the same thing... except contributors!

Actually, Kerry is benefitting more from the new law than Bush is. There are more registered 527 organizations supporting Kerry than there are supporting Bush. There is also MUCH more money going to Kerry-supporting 527 organizations than Bush-supporting.

In reviewing where the parties get their money, The DNC gets MUCH more money from the wealthy than the RNC. The RNC gets more from individual contributors contributing less than $250.

cyrijl
25th September 04, 01:20 PM
joenoob, i think the dollars spent on 527's is between 3:1 and 5:1 in favor of kerry supporters. I put 3:1 to be hyper conservative in the reports i have heard.