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View Full Version : WTF? Bush wasn't lying after all?



Akuma
5th May 04, 08:30 AM
Looks like Pres. Bush wasn't lying about Iraq's WMD's after all.

http://www.insightmag.com/news/2004/05/11/World/Investigative.Reportsaddams.Wmd.Have.Been.Found-670120.shtml

The Wastrel
5th May 04, 08:56 AM
Reading is FUNdamental.

WingChun Lawyer
5th May 04, 09:59 AM
First they say this:

"In virtually every case - chemical, biological, nuclear and ballistic missiles - the United States has found the weapons and the programs that the Iraqi dictator successfully concealed for 12 years from U.N. weapons inspectors."

Then they say this:

"There is a long list of charges made by the U.S. that have been confirmed, but none of this seems to mean anything because the weapons that were unaccounted for by the United Nations remain unaccounted for."

patfromlogan
5th May 04, 10:03 AM
Kay's quotes seem to not agree with other stuff he's said.

garbanzo
5th May 04, 10:13 AM
If I understand the article correctly, it claims that the Bush adminstration was not lying
when it claimed Iraq had WMD, but rather, that they are covering of the fact that they have
found them.

Hmmm.

punchingdummy
5th May 04, 10:48 AM
I think what the article is saying is that Bush administration is largely correct in their position that Iraq had WMD and had violated relevent UN resolutions but is unable to provide the smoking gun.

Nothing new here....

Chris.B
5th May 04, 10:49 AM
It seems Bush has some common scence.

Balloonknot
5th May 04, 12:36 PM
lol, if you believe that crap. Bush has no proof nor did he EVER have proof!! Get it?

Bolverk
5th May 04, 01:24 PM
Gee, are we all reading the same article?

My interpretation is that the chemicals that were found were both precursors and some of the actual chemical agents. However, because it does not fit into the story line the press is selling, it is not reported. And that the ISG is also being a bit ignorant or evasive in claiming that precursors that are found are pesticides only, even though they are being found in obvious military locations and being protected in bunkers.

Perhaps the author and others are correct in saying that these finds are not sensational enough, and that is why they are not being reported for what they truly are.

Phoenix
5th May 04, 02:13 PM
Oh, I get it.

So, by that rationale, if I have chemicals in my garage/household that can be POTENTALLY used to make a weapon of some sorts, like say...chlorine bleach and ammonia, does that mean that the cops have the right to bust into my house and start some shit?

By the way, chlorine bleach and ammonia combined forms phosgene gas - a chemical weapon used by Saddam Hussein during the Gulf War.

Point being, just because the pieces are there, it doesn't necessarily follow that they fit.

Beatdown Richie
5th May 04, 02:19 PM
Does anyone seriously believe that if WMD were indeed found, it wouldn't be all over Fox News in an instant?

And at least some of the items on that list are old hats, like those drones - IIRC, they found a prototype of an unmanned reconnaissance craft, patched together from balsa wood and duct tape and not capable of carrying significant amount of anything.
And the rest contains a lot of "might"s and "could"s and "intended"s. Yeah. Saddam was a sneaky evil bastard, but I see nothing to convince me that he was an immediate threat to the safety of the US or anyone except his own people.

jabe josh
5th May 04, 04:39 PM
in all honesty i don't like how he went in at all. although if bush can actually pull it ioff it would be wonderful to have a free middle east, or at the least iraq!! hay free people not being killed and rapped is wonderful! but bush went in their guns a blazing self reightus crazy bastard. ggrr... just don't like his manner at all. although i also don't live withing exact lines of good and evil in my philosophies . it takes alot for me to see something as evil.

Dochter
5th May 04, 05:28 PM
Originally posted by jabe josh
in all honesty i don't like how he went in at all. although if bush can actually pull it ioff it would be wonderful to have a free middle east, or at the least iraq!! hay free people not being killed and rapped is wonderful! but bush went in their guns a blazing self reightus crazy bastard. ggrr... just don't like his manner at all. although i also don't live withing exact lines of good and evil in my philosophies . it takes alot for me to see something as evil.

Did you manage to actually write all those words and not say anything?


Yes, yes you did.

Bolverk
6th May 04, 03:09 PM
Gee, your statement seems rational on the surface, but I bet you don't store your bleach and ammonia in a military bunker. And I doubt that any of your neighbors have been found with the residual affects of exposure to these chemicals. Use a little logic.


Originally posted by Rising Phoenix
Oh, I get it.

So, by that rationale, if I have chemicals in my garage/household that can be POTENTALLY used to make a weapon of some sorts, like say...chlorine bleach and ammonia, does that mean that the cops have the right to bust into my house and start some shit?

By the way, chlorine bleach and ammonia combined forms phosgene gas - a chemical weapon used by Saddam Hussein during the Gulf War.

Point being, just because the pieces are there, it doesn't necessarily follow that they fit.

WingChun Lawyer
6th May 04, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by Bolverk
Gee, your statement seems rational on the surface, but I bet you don't store your bleach and ammonia in a military bunker. And I doubt that any of your neighbors have been found with the residual affects of exposure to these chemicals. Use a little logic.

Bolverk, from what I remember about that article, most of the findings only proved that Saddam once had WMD - and no one doubts it, since the good olī USA sent them his way in the 80īs (I posted a thread with a link to a legislative report on US chemical weapons shipped to Iraq).

The point is, no ready to use WMD were found, and the article does not contradict this statement. This means Iraq was not an immediate threat to the USA; ergo, Bush lied.

Mind you, Iīm not defending Saddam, he should be tried and hanged. But this doesnīt mean Bush should walk away free after lying to the american congress (remember the african uranium issue).

Phoenix
6th May 04, 03:20 PM
Originally posted by Bolverk
Gee, your statement seems rational on the surface, but I bet you don't store your bleach and ammonia in a military bunker. And I doubt that any of your neighbors have been found with the residual affects of exposure to these chemicals. Use a little logic.

That's not the point, Bolverk, and you know it.

The point is that they found components that could potentially be used to make chemical weapons, but no actual chemical weapons. There was NO smoking gun, so to speak.

What they found is equivalent to circumstantial evidence, which is usually not admissible in a court of law (except in extreme cases, such as sexual assault). One thing's for certain - the police do not have grounds to arrest a person based solely on circumstantial evidence, and if they do, they'd better have a damn good reason.

I certainly don't think the 'circumstantial evidence' found by the US was sufficient grounds to invade and tear apart a country...even if the country's ruler was Saddam Hussein.

Freddy
6th May 04, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by Akuma
Looks like Pres. Bush wasn't lying about Iraq's WMD's after all.

http://www.insightmag.com/news/2004/05/11/World/Investigative.Reportsaddams.Wmd.Have.Been.Found-670120.shtml
Giving the fact that the U.S. military sold Iraq anthrax shouldnt be a surprise. As for chemical weopons everyone knew that. it was the West whole sold them the equipment. As for atomic weopons thats a whole different story.:eek