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Boyd
21st March 04, 01:29 PM
That is all.

Osu
21st March 04, 01:31 PM
I wonder how you get your 2529 posts...

Chris.B
21st March 04, 01:49 PM
Umm, welcome......so this is how you get 2530 posts.

Boyd
21st March 04, 01:53 PM
Christiankarate is going to be totally sweet and you know it.

MaverickZ
21st March 04, 02:23 PM
yeah, most of us are dirty athiest unwashed heathens who need a good talking to.

Chris.B
21st March 04, 02:23 PM
I'm confused, how does karate and religion go together. In most religions they go on about how you shoudn't fight, and should never fight back or something like that. Then karate, fight back and destroy them.

nihilist
21st March 04, 02:46 PM
Jesus never had the benefit of knowing kata, if he did things may have been far different.

Deadpan Scientist
21st March 04, 03:03 PM
Where is this newbie?

Stick
21st March 04, 03:11 PM
Originally posted by nedhinkly
if you took a REAL martial ART you would know that the true meaning of martial arts is the development of oneself and one's love of the Lord Jesus Christ.

I was unaware Japanese, Chinese, Thai, Indonesian, Philipino, or for that matter evevn Western masters included a belief in christ as the lord and saviour as an integral part of their martial ways..... but hey, whatever floats your boat.

nihilist
21st March 04, 03:15 PM
Ever heard of Christian Science?
I think you get my point.

Stick
21st March 04, 03:17 PM
Ah, yes... the fake kind...

BTW, welcome ChristianKarate, believe ir or not I mean you no harm ^_^

Samuel Browning
21st March 04, 03:59 PM
At least this balances off Freddy, our favorite devil worshiper

Phoenix
21st March 04, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by Dai-Tenshi
Ah, yes... the fake kind...

BTW, welcome ChristianKarate, believe ir or not I mean you no harm ^_^


The fake kind.....BWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Raven
21st March 04, 04:03 PM
Mav and Mike were pretty funny in this topic.

FingerorMoon?
21st March 04, 05:34 PM
Welcome.

Jolly_Roger
21st March 04, 08:12 PM
Hey, Christian Karate is a reality.
It was taught with jesus when he was in Japan:
http://www.abc.net.au/foreign/stories/s317737.htm
It shows the influence of chinese styles (I'm assuming Christ went to china also), and includes Sanchin kata, Bassai-Dai Kata, and I'm a fuckng messiah, unbeliver!! Kata.
You can watch some forms and sparring on this account of the savior's life:
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0311361/

Christian Buddah Fist!!!

The_Ghost
21st March 04, 10:51 PM
It's good to have another believer on this forum. Sometimes I think there isn't enough Faith around here.

I know, too much simple logic. Not all of us can rely on blind faith..but hey, it's all 'relative'. lol

Deadpan Scientist
21st March 04, 10:54 PM
the guy has 0 posts, wtf hasn't he posted here

Jenfucius
21st March 04, 10:54 PM
i don't even beeeelieeeve in jebus!!!

Jenfucius
21st March 04, 10:55 PM
save me jebus!!!!

The_Ghost
21st March 04, 10:57 PM
So you don't believe in Jebus, but you want him to save you?

:)

Stick
21st March 04, 10:59 PM
"SANCTUARY!"

"Oh, why did I teach him that word?"

The_Ghost
21st March 04, 11:01 PM
I believe Nietzsche destroyed any reasoning the Christians had, and now we've moved past them.

Not to say that he disproved Jesus, just the christian religion.

Jenfucius
21st March 04, 11:02 PM
the lord is powerful, but insecure. like barbara streisand before james brolan. oh, he's been a rock...

The_Ghost
21st March 04, 11:05 PM
LOL! Jenfucius, funny shit.

Stick
21st March 04, 11:06 PM
Uh-oh, this is gonna turn into one of "those" threads again...

Jenfucius
21st March 04, 11:12 PM
dude, i majored in simpsons in college. i minored in seinfeld.

Jolly_Roger
22nd March 04, 12:15 AM
So we only have to fly you to a island to spread the word of Jebus, so you can do karate to small childres (watch out! they surround you at night, in the alleys)...

manchuria
22nd March 04, 12:56 AM
helo0o0 new member where R U @???


heheh, i said member...

hapki_18
22nd March 04, 01:32 AM
yay, my chance to postwhore

nihilist
22nd March 04, 01:58 AM
Originally posted by manchuria
helo0o0 new member where R U @???


heheh, i said member...

You know damn well where he went.
He suddenly realized that this board is tantamount to the antichrist and fled, clutching his crucifix nunchaku.

Kenshin
22nd March 04, 02:00 AM
We need more devil worshippers around here.

Y'know, just to spice things up.

nihilist
22nd March 04, 02:17 AM
Devil worship....Who has the time?

TaeBo_Master
22nd March 04, 02:19 AM
We need the Shaolin Monks back. That was interesting.

manchuria
22nd March 04, 03:37 AM
bJj DoEsNt WoRk On T3h Cr0s$!

Jolly_Roger
22nd March 04, 01:35 PM
Originally posted by mike reese
Devil worship....Who has the time?

Or the money?

Boyd
22nd March 04, 10:59 PM
This thread officially blows. Time to start pitching my new movie idea. The idea first hit me when I accidentally walked into Passion of the Christ while watching Dawn of the Dead. Basically, my movie, "God is Undead" is an artistic rendition of the spread of Christianity immediately after the crucifixtion. Three days after being nailed to the cross by a crowd of unruly Jews, Jesus rises from the dead...ready to KILL! The Messiah then goes on a cross-country rampage, naked aside from a crown of thorns and screaming incoherently, attacking everyone in sight. Compounding matters is the fact that everyone bitten by Jesus becomes a Christian themself and can only be killed with silver bullets. I don't want to give away the ending, but let's just say that the Hindus were right all along.

FingerorMoon?
22nd March 04, 11:14 PM
The video game 'Gabriel Knight 3: Blood of the Sacred, Blood of the Damned' has the storyline that those that drank from the holy grail (the cup that caught his blood) were the worlds first vampires.

Jenfucius
23rd March 04, 12:33 AM
Originally posted by manchuria
bJj DoEsNt WoRk On T3h Cr0s$!

need i remind you that the "crucifix" worked really well on jesus...or DID IT???

Stick
23rd March 04, 12:48 AM
@Boyd, don't steal movie ideas from newgrounds. It leads to loss of brain.... er, something or other.

http://www.newgrounds.com/portal/view/152358

tool.

Ronin
23rd March 04, 08:30 AM
Religion has been around for thousands of years and you guys think YOUR opinon matters ??? or some a-hole like Nietsche ???
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH !!!!!!!!!
That is one of the best ones I heard so far !!!!!!
HAHAHA !!!!

Crazy Carl
23rd March 04, 01:34 PM
he has to post...he has to

tkdan28
23rd March 04, 01:53 PM
Originally posted by nedhinkly
It's good to have another believer on this forum. Sometimes I think there isn't enough Faith around here.

I liked Faith... except when she hooked up with the mayor.

Stick
23rd March 04, 02:12 PM
tkdan, you rule.

Jenfucius
23rd March 04, 09:11 PM
ah faith, the last refuge of teh irrational.

Phrost
23rd March 04, 09:38 PM
I will not get into a discussion on Religion on Bullshido.
I will not get into a discussion on Religion on Bullshido.
I will not get into a discussion on Religion on Bullshido.
I will not get into a discussion on Religion on Bullshido.
I will not get into a discussion on Religion on Bullshido.
I will not get into a discussion on Religion on Bullshido.

FingerorMoon?
23rd March 04, 09:48 PM
Oh go on, you know you want to.
Oh go on, you know you want to.
Oh go on, you know you want to.
Oh go on, you know you want to.
Oh go on, you know you want to.
Oh go on, you know you want to.

Meteora
23rd March 04, 10:22 PM
"Why do we all just get on our knee's and please our lord?"

Stick
23rd March 04, 11:13 PM
"I wanna get down on my knee's and start please'n Jesus,
I wanna feel his salvation come'n all over my face!"
- Eric Cartman of Faith+1

That was an awesome episode.

Double Mirr ^_^

FingerorMoon?
23rd March 04, 11:19 PM
Oh no, I've been called irrational by a medical wannabe Dork, Whatever will I do.

I like DRD version1.5
Just like the old DRD, with added sarcasm.

Boyd
23rd March 04, 11:23 PM
Originally posted by DRD
The Christian Religion will not be disproven while I am alive simply because I believe and will stand by that belief even in the face of the moronic comments made by those who don't.

I don't think anyone who believes in invisible cloudmen that are deeply interested in where we put our weiners has any right to call other things "moronic".

Bard of DorAr
23rd March 04, 11:29 PM
At times of this fighting between Atheism and Science versus Christianity.....

I feel a strong urge to plug the game Xenogears where you find out God is a crash landed Artificial Intelligence super weapon that created human beings to someday provide replacement parts for his organic aspects once he had repaired is mechanical side. And then after killing us all he will go to a new world to fight..

That and it has Giant Robots. How can you go wrong?

Stick
23rd March 04, 11:31 PM
"I am Trapper-Keeper!"

nihilist
24th March 04, 12:16 AM
A person's religion is almost solely determined by place of birth and one's parents' choice of faith; that in itself is reason enough to doubt the existence of a "ONE TRUE GOD".

grego
24th March 04, 12:32 AM
Check and mate.

Dochter
24th March 04, 01:11 AM
Originally posted by Boyd
I don't think anyone who believes in invisible cloudmen that are deeply interested in where we put our weiners has any right to call other things "moronic".

The quote material thread died awhile ago, but this is still gold.

Ronin
24th March 04, 07:52 AM
Religious people and non-religious people have co-exsisted since the beginning of recorded history, its not you bunch of cabbage patch dolls that are going to change ANYONES ideas, so drop it, its getting old and tired, like the hills on granny's chest and just as dusty.

Meteora
24th March 04, 10:59 AM
Originally posted by Dai-Tenshi
"I wanna get down on my knee's and start please'n Jesus,
I wanna feel his salvation come'n all over my face!"
- Eric Cartman of Faith+1

That was an awesome episode.

Double Mirr ^_^

See that moment was a added bouns for me because I had a Youth Group leader say that to a class. Needless to say couldn't help but fall over laughing. Glad my mother stop trying to make me go to those things and just accept I'm never never never never never evar going back to church ever.

nihilist
24th March 04, 11:35 AM
Originally posted by ronin69
Religious people and non-religious people have co-exsisted since the beginning of recorded history, its not you bunch of cabbage patch dolls that are going to change ANYONES ideas, so drop it, its getting old and tired, like the hills on granny's chest and just as dusty.

Nothing has caused more persecution, torture, murder, and general hatred than RELIGION.

Non-religious people have always been despised by religious bigots who think it is their duty to convert or destroy nonbelievers.

I have no problem with people of faith, unless they are trying to use their belief (and by extention their God) as a weapon or an excuse to cause harm.

Let me ask a question, if the entire world was athiest, what would they be fighting over in the middle east right about now?

Hmmm...

Ronin
24th March 04, 11:47 AM
Originally posted by mike reese
Nothing has caused more
Non-religious people have always been despised by religious bigots who think it is their duty to convert or destroy nonbelievers.

I have no problem with people of faith, unless they are trying to use their belief (and by extention their God) as a weapon or an excuse to cause harm.

Let me ask a question, if the entire world was athiest, what would they be fighting over in the middle east right about now?

Hmmm...

Don't ever confuse EXCUSES with REASONS.
Religion has been the BIGGEST EXCUSE for what you said but rarely has it been the TRUE REASON.

And the middle east has always been about oil,land and water. Those are the REASONS and religion is the excuse they use.
And, money, land and ethnic hatred has caused A LOT more
"persecution, torture, murder, and general hatred" than religion ever has.

Bard of DorAr
24th March 04, 11:53 AM
Mike, you said it yourself, you don't like people using religion as a weapon or excuse to do wrong. Both those things speak of a tool being misused, not of the tool itself being to blaim for anything.

Ronin hit it on the head. Religion is a convenient excuse for whatever a nutjob wants to do. If the entire world were athiest they'd be fighting over something else in the middle east. or elsewhere. End to religious intolerance and difference won't stop wars, just the reasons some of them are fought.

And honestly, I see as much hatred, complaining and superiority complex from athiests as I do from Christianity. Christianity just gets brought to the forfront more often.

Honestly, for every Christian insisting everyone who's not (Insert denomination here) is going to hell there's an athiest trying to prove a negative and insisting that just because it's not been proven yet unfailingly proves that it's impossible. It's just as absurd as insisting that only one religion is right, but they get the benefit of saying "We're just being Reasonable and thinking, those other guys are blindly believing in something." heh.

Oh well, least neither of ya are wiccans.

nihilist
24th March 04, 12:00 PM
You are only partly correct, however at the end of the day when a man blows himself up claimimg to do the work of Allah, one wonders if he was really just after oil, money, and land or possibly just peeved that someone of a different race exists.

Bard of DorAr
24th March 04, 12:02 PM
In that case I'd say it's a reilgious zealot, however, again, there are zealots for all kinds of things. Look at the KKK, most of them are way over zealous for beliefs that aren't requiring religion to exist. Same thing with people overly patriotic. I could see activities involving suicide bombings based on defending one's land or what one percieves as their land just as easily as I can see a religious whack job doing it.

On another note, when the core of a religion isn't particuarly vicious and cruel, blaiming the entire thing based on extremist factions is a little silly. I don't look at people who are just genuinely proud of their heritage and hold them responsible for what whack jobs like the KKK do based on being proud of their heritage. I hold the whack-jobs accountable and the rest innocent.

nihilist
24th March 04, 12:13 PM
The KKK are christians, not athiests.

You are proving my point.

nihilist
24th March 04, 12:26 PM
I think Boyd registered as "Christiankarate" to start with and that's why 0 posts...

Bard of DorAr
24th March 04, 02:01 PM
You don't really read and comprehend much? Or just in this case? I never said the KKK were athiest. I said the KKK's beliefs that are so despised by sane people do not require religion to exist. Christianity isn't the center of their racial bigotry, it's a convenient extra to help try and defend themselves and to have as an extra shield ("God said to do it") Their beliefs could EASILY exist without any religious influence. And my point was that I would not hold your standard person proud of their German/Brittish/(Insert Caucasian here) heritage as responsible for the actions of nut jobs with similar beliefs.

in the same sense I hardly blame Islamic faith as a whole because a fringe of them are psychopaths.

I note however you didn't bother to address the point I was making. You instead latched on to what you percieved as a flaw in my statement (Which actually wasn't) and claimed that it helped your point.

Dochter
24th March 04, 02:16 PM
Originally posted by Bard of DorAr
(A)And honestly, I see as much hatred, complaining and superiority complex from athiests as I do from Christianity. Christianity just gets brought to the forfront more often.

(B)Honestly, for every Christian insisting everyone who's not (Insert denomination here) is going to hell there's an athiest trying to prove a negative and insisting that just because it's not been proven yet unfailingly proves that it's impossible. It's just as absurd as insisting that only one religion is right, but they get the benefit of saying "We're just being Reasonable and thinking, those other guys are blindly believing in something." heh.



While Mike Reese seems to have this well in hand I'd like to make the following comments:

A) Really? Do have anything besides personal observations to back this up? As mentioned hatred towards groups almost invariably has a religious basis, if not inherently religious. People hate gays because what they do is "against god" (this may even be subconcious because of a judeo christian upbringing and the idea of Sodom being destroyed). Somehow miscegnation is against god black people are evil and the descendants of cain. Someone who doesn't accept any of those concepts is going to have a hard time maintaining an irrational hatred.

As for religion being simply an excuse, I think that is only part of the case. If something consistently gives people a reason to hate, maybe there is an inherent problem.

B) Somehow when an atheist says "it is fine that you believe that but what evidence do you have for a supernatural phenomenon exists?" They are trying to prove a negative. Give me a break.

As for the absurdity of dismissing all instead of accepting one, what is more ridiculous: Saying, hey there really isn't anything to support any of these beliefs so I'll drop all of them unless some proof comes along. or hey I'm going to take this set of unsupported beliefs as opposed to selecting any of the equally improbable beliefs that are simarilly unsupported. Do you really not see a difference.

Bard of DorAr
24th March 04, 03:13 PM
I'm not arguing against wanting proof or being an athiest. My point was specifically in regaurds to overly zealous athiests existing much as overly zealous (insert pet religion here) exist. About one in every ten athiests I've met have gone the exact same route of the close minded. IE they state that because there isn't any evidence currently it is irrevocably false and wrong to believe a god exists. This is a far cry from the other nine in question who say "There's no proof. Show me something resembling hard evidence and I'll consider reevaluating my opinion." Note the difference? That one in ten is about the same rate I come across Christians who want to insist I'm damned to hell for not being part of their pet faith.

As for the KKK. While there's some small religious link in the overall beliefs. I've yet to truly come across a white supremacist that doesn't like non-caucasians based on religious reasons. It's always been that they're genetically, intellectually, etc, etc, inferior to the white man. The last debate I had around it was because the person felt that you look at Africa and all they've ever been were little villages warring with each other selling each other into slavery (how did the US get slaves to begin with?) Etc, etc, where as the white man made civilization, blah blah blah blah. All in all absurd belief. But no where in that belief was it stemmed that "god doesn't like black people the way he likes us."

As for my thoughts towards Christianity being brought to the front during these types of talks. Yeah, it does, right ahead of islam or behind it depending on the conversation in question. It's the more popular religion for the most part, thusly earning the largest grouping of both skeptics and nutjobs (Nutjobs being overgone Christians and skeptics being anyone not christian). Heck, most of my debates with other people have started with my disagreements with Christianity then turn to my defending it when umpteen people jump on the bandwagon blindly. To use a really really bad analogy. You can find people who like pepsi over coke and various store brands, and they can tell you why it is that they dislike coke, but generally haven't had the store brand to make the other comparison. Not really the best analogy, but a show that the more mainstream/known faiths are going to be recognized for good or ill more often than lesesr known things or less accepted things.

nasty_totoro
24th March 04, 03:42 PM
let's settle this with a throwdown ....

christians against infidels and heretics ...

or was it christians vs. lions .... hmmm :D

Dochter
24th March 04, 03:46 PM
A differentiating element, particularly an unsubstantiated and completely arbitrary one, will always foster dislike between groups.

Whether or not there are inherently rascist/bigoted elements to a belief system (and I certainly don't think this is consistently true in any of the major religions) is irrelevant in the face of repeated examples of those elements arising out of that belief system. If what appears to be a perfectly healthy cow repeatedly produces some bad milk eventually you start looking to the cow for answers. Of course in that case all you'll ever get is a "moo".


By the way in regards to your first comment it is actually outright wrong to proclaim something to be a fact in the absence of any confirmatory evidence, in the presence of equally reasonable (or depending on your bias unreasonable) explanations, and here is the kicker: in the presence of essentially a null model that explains things in a manner that is supported by the evidence. After seeing this done often enough it isn't surprising that someone would become reactionary and dissmissive... human nature to do so.

Ronin
24th March 04, 04:19 PM
You're all wrong ( unless you aree with me) and I am right !!
PS: You're all going to hell, unless you agree with me, well, even then...

nihilist
24th March 04, 08:21 PM
Hell is one of my favorite concepts, it shows the overwhelmingly commpassionate disposition of the Almighty.

nihilist
24th March 04, 09:14 PM
Bard of DorAr, I apologize I was in a hurry this morning and was responding to Ronin and didn't notice your first post, so you probably thought I was responding to you.

Let me address some of your statements now that I have a few minutes:

"Mike, you said it yourself; you don't like people using religion as a weapon or excuse to do wrong. Both those things speak of a tool being misused, not of the tool itself being to blame for anything.”

I don’t blame Jerry Springer for the chairs being thrown, but that’s what happens there, consistently, I might add.


”Ronin hit it on the head. Religion is a convenient excuse for whatever a nut job wants to do. If the entire world were atheist they'd be fighting over something else in the Middle East. or elsewhere. End to religious intolerance and difference won't stop wars, just the reasons some of them are fought”

Who gives a shit what EXCUSE someone gives when they run a plane into your office building? The point is that it isn’t atheists doing it.


“And honestly, I see as much hatred, complaining and superiority complex from atheists as I do from Christianity. Christianity just gets brought to the forefront more often.”

And just how is this alleged atheist hatred manifesting itself? What is the sum total of the human suffering? Just give me an educated guess.

“Honestly, for every Christian insisting everyone who's not (Insert denomination here) is going to hell there's an atheist trying to prove a negative and insisting that just because it's not been proven yet unfailingly proves that it's impossible. It's just as absurd as insisting that only one religion is right, but they get the benefit of saying "We're just being Reasonable and thinking, those other guys are blindly believing in something." heh.”

I think you have spent too much time on atheist debate boards to have any type of rounded view of what is to be an atheist. The average heretic doesn’t care whether Jebus exists or not, in fact, he/she doesn’t care whether or not others are religious as long as they don’t have to put up with proselytizing, threats, or of course violent outbursts.

Oh well, least neither of ya are Wiccans."

Oh, are they dangerous as well?

nihilist
24th March 04, 09:37 PM
Originally posted by Bard of DorAr
In that case I'd say it's a reilgious zealot, however, again, there are zealots for all kinds of things. Look at the KKK, most of them are way over zealous for beliefs that aren't requiring religion to exist. Same thing with people overly patriotic
On another note,

. I could see activities involving suicide bombings based on defending one's land or what one percieves as their land just as easily as I can see a religious whack job doing it.

Notice you said “I could see” That is like saying “I *could* see little green men; the fact is, you don’t…at least I hope you don’t


when the core of a religion isn't particuarly vicious and cruel, blaiming the entire thing based on extremist factions is a little silly. I don't look at people who are just genuinely proud of their heritage and hold them responsible for what whack jobs like the KKK do based on being proud of their heritage. I hold the whack-jobs accountable and the rest innocent.

Are you insinuating that I hold innocent people accountable for anything?
Please show me where I said this.

Boyd
24th March 04, 11:24 PM
Originally posted by DRD
I have no problem with you continuing to put your weiner in the same guys mouths you always have, and theirs in yours.

You're just cranky because the coexistence of "The Passion of the Christ" and "Dawn of the Dead" in one theatre has forced you to come to terms with the fact that you worship an undead ghoul.

nihilist
24th March 04, 11:33 PM
Dawn Of The Dead grossed more in three days than "Passion" did all month.

Surely this is a sign of the pocky-clipse.

Matt W.
25th March 04, 08:21 AM
And just how is this alleged atheist hatred manifesting itself? What is the sum total of the human suffering? Just give me an educated guess.

I don't know about the "sum total of the human suffering" but there have been many non-religious regimes led by men who were atheist that have done a lot of damage... Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot... I'm sure there's more.

Matt

Ronin
25th March 04, 08:30 AM
Originally posted by mike reese
Dawn Of The Dead grossed more in three days than "Passion" did all month.

Surely this is a sign of the pocky-clipse.

Wrong. so wrong...
Fucking cyborgs !! can't do anything right !!

By the way, from your earlier post:
"Who gives a shit what EXCUSE someone gives when they run a plane into your office building? The point is that it isn’t atheists doing it."
While you have a point, in the most fucked up way possible, IF we do NOT care about the REASONS people do what they do, we will NEVER be able to SOLVE the problem, and THAT is a FACT.

Bard of DorAr
25th March 04, 10:40 AM
Matt and Ronin beat me to the punch on most of that.

Honestly, i said least you're not Wiccan not out of thought that Wiccans are dangerous, but that they disgust me on major levels. Compare actual gardnerian wicca to what gets published under deluded little names like "Silver Ravenwolf" and you get the quick picture of what I dislike about em. That and what they say on www.whywiccanssuck.com

and in regaurds to the whole "The average heretic doesn't" thing. Of course the average doesn't, hence my rough one in ten number I stated. My point wasn't that lots and lots of athiests are whack jobs or close minded, my point was I find about the same percentage of closed minded people in any given faith or non-faith.

And PS: Leave the little green men out of it... <.< >.> <qw> they can hear it when you talk about them... They don't like it! Bad things happen!!!!

nihilist
25th March 04, 12:12 PM
Ok, so Matt found three bad athiests and Bard is now hatin' Wiccans, Very nice.

nihilist
25th March 04, 12:28 PM
Originally posted by ronin69
Wrong. so wrong...
Fucking cyborgs !! can't do anything right !!

By the way, from your earlier post:
"Who gives a shit what EXCUSE someone gives when they run a plane into your office building? The point is that it isn’t atheists doing it."
While you have a point, in the most fucked up way possible, IF we do NOT care about the REASONS people do what they do, we will NEVER be able to SOLVE the problem, and THAT is a FACT.

I meant I don't care about SPECIFIC reasons ie: "we hate USA because you help Jews"

The point is that these ancient Bullshido religions teach bigotry and divide people.

If you can't see that, you are being intellectually dishonest.

Just because something is ancient does not mean it is somehow mystical, or somehow viable, on the contrary, people used to believe in all sorts of bullshit: ghosts, goblins, witches, fairies etc.

What is the difference between qi-balls and [insert "miracle" here]???

Ronin
25th March 04, 12:36 PM
Look leather boy, just because that is what YOU have been exposed to, does NOT mean that that is HOW it is, ok?
Use the MA as an analogy ok, for every fuck nut making outrageous claims about this or that from ANY given style, there are hundreds, if not thousands from the VERY system, shaking their heads at anyone dumb enough to believe him.
Now, replace the thousands with 10's of millions and you have a very similar case with religion.

Bard of DorAr
25th March 04, 12:48 PM
You know, accusing someone of being dishonest or refusing to see the truth of a matter when you yourself read the words "one in ten" and respond with a complaint that "Your average X isn't like that." which was never implied otherwise... hmm.

nihilist
25th March 04, 01:08 PM
You guys act like I'm arguing with you when In fact I'm stating my opinion which may or may not run paralell with your own beliefs.

Most of the religious people that I have met over the years are decent, compassionate folks.
I am not talking about them; I am talking about the few, the proud, the zealots.

Superstitious belief systems create a petre dish with all the ingredients to grow a full-fledged hate-mongering close-minded fuckwad.

Am I coming in loud and clear this time?
Hello?...Is this thing on?

nihilist
25th March 04, 01:17 PM
And furthermore, I'd like to be addressed as Sir or Mr. leatherboy from now on if you don't mind.

Dochter
25th March 04, 02:02 PM
Originally posted by Dochter
A differentiating element, particularly an unsubstantiated and completely arbitrary one, will always foster dislike between groups.

Whether or not there are inherently rascist/bigoted elements to a belief system (and I certainly don't think this is consistently true in any of the major religions) is irrelevant in the face of repeated examples of those elements arising out of that belief system. If what appears to be a perfectly healthy cow repeatedly produces some bad milk eventually you start looking to the cow for answers. Of course in that case all you'll ever get is a "moo".

I think this is a lot of what Mike is trying to say (which was ignored when I said it fucktards). This first part is probably the most important.

Justme
25th March 04, 02:05 PM
Did you say Latherboy? My hearing isn't what it used to be....sorry....

MichaelDescado
25th March 04, 02:06 PM
The simple fact of the matter is, religion is faith based, and thus open for individual interpretation. It's different for everybody, which is why 1) NOBODY can agree, and 2) said disagreement causes conflict.

Secondly, atheism is not a religion no matter how bad you want it to be. Stop comparing Atheists to Christians! Religion plays very little part in Atheism, unless said atheist was once a religious person, (like me), and eventually BECAME an atheist.

Go here to read how this happened:

http://michaeldescado.tripod.com/stories/id21.html

There's a HUGE emotional expenditure put into religious beliefs, chiefly because they deal with what is our species' most deeply ingrained fear: Death. Our evolutionary survival instincts are the very reason why we're here, so, naturally, we strive to live. The thought of not living terrifies the hell out of us, which is why when religion comes along, with its soothing promises of eternal paradise, people cling so tenaciously to it. Again, there's a HUGE emotional attachment.

This is simply not so with Atheists, who, despite sharing the same evolutionary "fear" of death, can't convince themselves of something there's no evidence for. Personally, I can no more "choose" to believe in God than I can "choose" to believe in the tooth fairy. I simply don't have that mindset, and most atheists don't either.

This lack of capacity for self deception, coupled with NOT having all the emotional attachments to religion, is why you don't see atheists being zealots. Conversely, religious people are allowed to pull their beliefs from the limitless realm of the supernatural, thus, they can believe in or justify ANYTHING. In addition, religion is much simpler, and thus appeals to the uneducated masses.

It takes no brains to believe in God.

MichaelDescado
25th March 04, 02:28 PM
I should clarify by saying that while, yes, our prime evolutionary drive is to survive, said drive goes hand in hand with the quest to reproduce.

(just in case anybody was gonna try to bust me on that)

Ronin
25th March 04, 02:55 PM
Michael hit it on the head, subject to undividual interpretations.
And Mr. leatherboy, we understood what you were saying, we just chose to ignore it :)

Dochter
25th March 04, 02:59 PM
A differentiating element, particularly an unsubstantiated and completely arbitrary one, will always foster dislike between groups.


Any comments Bard?

Matt W.
25th March 04, 03:44 PM
Dochter,

I'd say, remove "particularly an unsubstantiated and completely arbitrary one", change "will always" to "tends to" and I think you'd have a true statement. And that would explain not only religious animosity, but also racial, cultural, philosophical and even land/money (have, have not) conflicts.

Matt

Te No Kage!
25th March 04, 03:49 PM
I agree with some of what Micheal has to say but I don't think it's fair to imply that religious people are brainless or uneducated.

nihilist
25th March 04, 03:57 PM
He did use the word "foster" (To promote the growth and development of) which I think qualifies the statement.

nihilist
25th March 04, 04:00 PM
Originally posted by Te No Kage!
I agree with some of what Micheal has to say but I don't think it's fair to imply that religious people are brainless or uneducated.

It is worthy of note that Einstein had a belief in God.

nihilist
25th March 04, 04:01 PM
Originally posted by Justme
Did you say Latherboy? My hearing isn't what it used to be....sorry....

If you want lather, that costs extra.

BTW, you're in off topic discussion... AGAIN.

Xango
25th March 04, 04:30 PM
Originally posted by mike reese

And just how is this alleged atheist hatred manifesting itself? What is the sum total of the human suffering? Just give me an educated guess.


Communism, my friend. Communism.

Estimated deaths in the 20th century, 100 million. Estimated human suffering, incalculable.

Brought to you by the atheist fanatics of dialectical materialism.

Sorry to ventilate your argument, but it had to be done.

nihilist
25th March 04, 04:59 PM
That's ONE regime.
Brought to you by ONE dictator at a time.

More of an indictment on power hungry dictators that athieist hatred, I'm afraid.

What do you think might happen if fundamentalist fanatics had access to thousands of ICBMs?

Would they be more or less likely to incinerate the world than say... Stalin?

Dochter
25th March 04, 05:00 PM
Originally posted by Matt W.
Dochter,

I'd say, remove "particularly an unsubstantiated and completely arbitrary one", change "will always" to "tends to" and I think you'd have a true statement. And that would explain not only religious animosity, but also racial, cultural, philosophical and even land/money (have, have not) conflicts.

Matt

I agree with you that it will apply to most elements of life.
Why remove that section though?

Bard of DorAr
25th March 04, 05:43 PM
Doc, make the Second of the two changes Matt suggested and I agree with you completely. :)

As for the rest. Most are fully aware athiests aren't of a unified or particular faith of any sort. However when it comes down to it they can easily fall prey to the same type of close minded and insistant that their opinion is irrefutable delusion that is so often seen in most religions.

And Mike, you did get to the point that you said you weren't going to be blaiming other people for what some whackos do (Something i Never got the impression you were doing) If that's the case why is it you're debating that matter? As far as I can tell that's all myself or Ronin were going after. Just pointing out that there's whack jobs in almost any grouping of people and blaiming the thing used as a scapegoat isn't really the best option.

nihilist
25th March 04, 06:25 PM
The only thing open to debate is the ratio of "wack jobs" who gravitate towards a belief in the supernatural.

I think you know where my money is.

Leodom
25th March 04, 06:36 PM
Originally posted by mike reese
...What do you think might happen if fundamentalist fanatics had access to thousands of ICBMs?

Would they be more or less likely to incinerate the world than say... Stalin?

On the one hand -- some people think the current US Administration ARE fundamentalist fanatics and they DO have access to thousands of ICBMs.

On the other hand -- The current administration is working to prevent nuclear devices (including ICBMs) from getting into the hands of Islamic fundamentalists who would have NO PROBLEM incinerating the world.

nihilist
25th March 04, 07:48 PM
Bush has BOMBS????

[whispers] Oh, shit!!!